When Did We Stop Being Moms?

I agree with those who said this is media hype. I have a lot of mom friends, and none of us 'define what kind of mom we are'. We are all just moms, doing the best we can.

I assume this is coming from the blog today about the stay at home mom being happy her kids are going back to school.

My comment on that blog would have been exactly that-drop the stay at home part wherever she said it and just replace it with mom. No need to make the distinction really.

And I read it and wasn't offended by the stay at home part but it was unnecessary. She could have avoided a lot of negative comments by not reiterating her stay at home status.

I find it bizarre that so many people define themselves as moms. It is part of who I am. So is my career - maybe more so because I have been at it for 15 years longer plus education time. When I meet new people at a party, the dads still ask the men 'so what do you do'. I HATE that people now ask me whose mom or wife I am. And the SAHMs regard the ' what do you do?' question as rude.

I couldn't agree more.

As a Soldier and a mom, I've heard it often. That I'm not a "good mom" because I get deployed. Because I work in "a man's world." Because I don't stay at home and let a man do the breadwinning.

Yes, my experience is more extreme than that of most, but it's a good example of the judgment that is out there.

My kids are awesome. They're respectful, kind, funny, hard workers, animal lovers, eat all their veggies (and everything else in the house), like to play outside, love "I Dream of Jeannie" reruns, and are just SO, SO loved.

I'm a good mom.

And so are you.

ETA: Bless your heart, Scarlett. I think you've missed the entire point of the post.

You said it, sister. I feel like parenting has become a full-contact competitive sport. And some days, I feel like quitting the team.

Breast vs. bottle. Work vs. stay at home. Organic vs. not. Public school vs. private. Away school vs. homeschool. EVERYTHING is a battle of who is doing it best. And it seems like there is one side or the other, no middle ground.

I have two amazing kids. They are that way because I did what my husband and I felt was best for them, not what everyone else told me that I should be doing. I truly never felt the need to 'define' my parenting style, but wow, the judgments I had to endure were mind-numbing. But they turned out well and I am proud of them.

I so agree with you. It really does seem to divide, and I don't like it either.

I think the biggest problem we have as a culture is that the child has been placed upon the pedestal of society. There is really a whole industry driven by that belief, and the belief that mothers are like some kind of queen and should be honored and showered and treated as such. Motherhood and babies used to just be a fact of life, as ordinary as anything else. Kids used to be 'just kids', expected to adapt, expected to mind, and expected to make mistakes. Now we expect them to pass entrance exams in preschool so as to determine their eligibility for Top Tier schools and Ivy League universities. Parents are expected to follow more rules than children are. Some families have lost balance in over-immersing themselves in their children's lives or wanting to befriend their children instead of parent them. Others create problems by giving their kids too much responsibility and autonomy too soon (for the child) in a misguided attempt to encourage independence and confidence. Mom's are now expected to have the ultimate baby showers, they are expected to 'rock their bikini body' after just a few weeks, expected to still be sexy are supposed to want "more" (when maybe they think, golly gee, that they've already got a full plate). A maven in the kitchen, the ultimate playmate for her kids and wicked-hot in bed for her man.

(By the way, the above statements are not judgments toward any particular parents, but just observations and facts of life.)

Yeah, right.

I really feel bad for some of the new moms who get blindsided by all of this.

As a parent, I sometimes feel like a buoy, buffeted by waves of other parents and their choices, and thankful that I am anchored with my own chain so that I am not swept into all of this. I think what Karen M said is true... I've been hurt by well-meant advice, by 'you shoulds' and by a society which deems *anything* quirky or unusual about a kid as something which should be clinically treated. The sad thing is, most moms I know are conscientious and their own worst critics. (I do know a few that aren't, but they are the anomaly in this.)

We do what is best for our son, what we think will help, and seek out advice from those who have love and a vested interest in our family. As for the rest of those voices... they can have their say and I just have to let them be. I see other mothers struggling, and I am happy to help most of the time, without the condition that her family should do things the way I do. We all need a hand from time to time. My day is full enough just doing what needs to be done!

ETA: I do have to agree, too, that some of this is relatively new. When I first started working in childcare 20 years ago, most of this stuff just didn't even exist, aside from the working/stay at home parent dichotomy. But then again, I worked in child care, so I wasn't hearing any judgment from our clients!

I think the divide happened when we stopped trying to be moms and started trying to be THE BEST MOMS. who took their kids to the BEST toddler events, researched and fed them the BEST diet, Our parents didnt feel guilty if they didnt water down our juice, make their own baby food, or go to every single ball game, school function etc. and make sure we read two levels above grade level.
And being the best is easier to achieve if you point out that mommy across the street is Doing It Wrong.
Or maybe it was the criticism of stay at home moms (and working moms) that started the campaign to be the BEST mom ever, to defend their choice to stay at home. (or go to work) Not long ago, no one thought about defending staying home to raise children, anymore than men defended their decision to go to work.
Now some moms feel they need to prove something, which is sad.

I think this "division" exists a lot more in the media and online than it does in the real world. I have raised my kids in the same community for the past 13 years and I find the moms here VERY supportive of each other, whether they "work" or not, and regardless of how many kids they have (though I will say two kids is the norm in this area.) We babysit for each other, carpool, volunteer together, make meals when someone is sick, or has a new baby, provide money and treats and supplies for our teachers, all that good stuff. And it's NOT just the SAHMs doing this. We have a LOT of involved working moms as well.
I guess I'm lucky, this community is pretty solid. I feel like I have a substantial core network of women I can count on. Even the ones I don't know that well, well, they often know my kids, and that just makes us all a little kinder to each other I think.

No need to get put off by labels. So what if someone is bf v. formula, cry it out or co-sleeping, attachment, wah, sah, wooh, single, divorced, step, blended, religious, older, younger, rich, poor, etc. At the end of the day, they are parents, on a parenting page, seeking/ giving advice on how to parent and other attendant issues.

Keep on holding them up, helping them out, because regardless of what other attributes they have, labels they ascribe themselves, or philosophies they adhere to, they are still parents and parenting is still not an easy job.

Good luck to you and yours,
F. B. (full time working mother to DS pre-schooler, who is spirited. Short term full time breast feeder, ferberizer, day care user, urban woman, who shares her life with her naturalized British newly minted attorney husband and sometimes intrusive and overbearing parents while living a small urban co-op. Just another parent who needs support, because it is not an easy job.)

Hey Flaming Turnip... yeah, what the hay, right?

I dunno. I don't think about "categories" of Moms.
I am just a Mom.
The Moms I know are just Moms. Who do whatever else too.
Me too.
We are just Moms.
So be it.
I really hate the categorizing of Moms and the "trendy" terms and labels for Moms nowadays. As though some "types" of Moms are better than others or not.
I say, whatever.
We are Moms.
I am a Mom.
nuff' said.

I don't even attempt to categorize myself.
Whatever.
I am a Mom.
I do the best I can.
I am not perfect.
Who cares if I breastfed or not, swaddled or not, was "attachment" or not. Working or not. SAHM or not.
Whatever.
I'm a Mom.
I do what I do.

Why do Moms have to be trendy anyway or be the "latest" type of trendy Mom as is in the media.
I mean, some Moms try to fit INTO these categories.
Others just are, a Mom in their own skin.
Right.

It does divide. I think moms feel the need to justify themselves, like we're not enough. If you bottle feed, you're not enough b/c you didn't breastfeed. If you stay at home, you're not enough b/c you're not providing financially. Then if you work, you're not enough b/c someone else is raising your children. It's taken a village to raise children since the beginning of time, but now that its "daycare" some people attach a stigma. Parenting is hard work and very humbling. I think if everyone would support rather than try to be better than at everything they would be much happier.

J.,

I don't see people who have stopped being moms. I think that society has put a TON of pressure on people to "keep up with the Jones'".....your kids MUST go to "THIS" school in order to succeed...we have parents enrolling their children in pre-schools BEFORE they are born, because it's the "right" one....

I don't think I "fit" into any particular "type" of mom...does that make sense? I've been a SAHM, WOTHM and a WFHM....so I see more sides than just one...like you! I do what I need to do to take care of my children, make sure they are provided for and have experiences - both good and bad - and show them how to earn their way...

"Studies show" - yep - many people fall for that line....so when marketing firms are telling people that "studies show"......
IF they work outside the home, they are endangering their child,
IF they formula feed instead of breast feed, it's horrible and they are total failure
IF they do THIS it's wrong.
IF they do THAT it's right...

So people question and doubt themselves as parents...because our children ONLY DESERVE THE BEST....many parents DO for their kids instead of guiding them, mentoring, role modeling, etc....because I want you to have all that I didn't have growing up...sorry - but really? Because I don't recall ever going without growing up - my parents showed me how to take care of myself, how to earn things, etc. That's a parents role in my book....

Dividing seems to be the national pastime.

Luckily a small number of moms out there can recognize AND APPRECIATE the varying styles of moms and not feel the need to make it a negative judgment fest. Or maybe it's a big number but we just don't hear anything from the people who aren't participating in the antics.

Since I've been a sahm homsechooler, I just shut my yip about all other styles because I know stones are being hurled my way too and I don't want to participate. I respect moms who work and send kids to school. I respect moms with one kid or 10 kids. I respect city moms and country moms and rich moms and poor moms and single moms and married moms. OF COURSE, society needs everyone!!! I go out of my way to get along and be helpful with all moms in person and I save advice on kids bad behavior for anonymous places like...mampedia :)

As for when the need arose to define ourselves...seems like the trend is definitely newish-like past 10-15 years or maybe shorter? Or maybe I just wasn't paying attention before then. But I know my mom never had to defend herself for being a married military full-time nurse working mom of adopted kids. Or at least she didn't say anything about feeling judged...and I never heard her judging others. She was always helpful to all.

I'm not clear on all of your post. Yes a lot of us were able to stay home with our kids and felt that was a calling. It wasn't perfect and we weren't always supported. There are many more of us now who absolutely have to work because the salaries of one-job parents have not risen proportionally to expenses and cost of living. Moreover, a lot of us were not fulfilled as full-time SAHMs, and also more and more dads wanted to be hands-on parents (my husband is one of them).

I think competition arose in a lot of areas. The measure of your children became how many activities you could put them in and how much money you spent on academic preschools and computers for 2 week olds. To make up for being at work with long commutes, a lot of us signed kids up for paid activities so they could be in with a peer group that, for many reasons, didn't really exist in neighborhoods anymore. Kids were shlepped to play dates because there wasn't always a neighborhood network with so many kids in day care while parents struggled to make ends meet. Women who tried to make it on their own with a flexible schedule got met with resistance - witness your comments about "hitting us up to have a home party." That's not my thing, but it's no less intrusive than big companies marketing toys and gimmicks to my kids on commercials, or big pharmaceutical companies marketing drugs to my husband, or car companies marketing gas-guzzling cars to me.

But I see the competition on sites like Mamapedia too. There's a whole lot of quick judgment and labeling on here as well. Someone wants to work from home, and there's at least one response saying, "Watch out, here come the pitches from the multi-level marketing companies." Someone suggests counseling, and someone else jumps in and says, "Okay, there's one person on this site who always pushes counseling." Someone posts about a discipline or sleep problem, and the debate starts about cry-it-out or spanking or time outs. The people who can't spell are confusing those who can, and those who can spell or write clearly are frustrated by the ones who will just not put anything in a grammatical way that makes it easier to understand. Those who post a problem sometimes feel incredibly betrayed by anyone who doesn't agree with them. Whole lotta nastiness and it's made easier by the fact that we don't have face-to-face contact. Which I think, in part, gets back to your point about getting a good annual review when your kids made a good impression with face-to-face contact with teachers and schoolmates.

I think a lot of the change is due to technology. Technology is great and helps people network, which I think is especially important for those who are isolated either by geography or work schedule or from family or from anyone who shares their point of view. But it also means there is a level of isolation that is self-imposed, that we didn't have when SAHMs were together in the neighborhood or over the back fence or in a volunteer group. Parents and kids text each other, kids text friends, everyone's on a computer. We are quick to respond, quick to judge, and quick to label. So think there could be a lot more of what you mention - holding each other up and so on - on Mamapedia!

Not sure if that's at all what you were going for in your post. If I missed your major point, I apologize.

So, I agree, I dislike the lables. But I will say, that I have inquired about certian things but not in a who is better than who way. I inquire because I always look out side the box when looking for answers.

EX: my son is ADHD/ Sensory. At this time I do not wish to medicate him, I looked for alternatives. I have found changing his diet, to Gluten Free, Dye free, chocolate free, and HFCS free as well as sending him for Accupunture has made a huge postivie difference.

My titile- Mom who wants the best for her child. ... Isn't that yours?

I very much dislike the battle of Breast vs bottle, working vs stay home. I think in the end we all try to do the best for our kids the way we see fit. We all hope to have guided that child to a responsible adut .... We all cringe when we see a child fall, or hear about that child who is sick. etc.. We are all human trying our best.

:)

I agree that the media plays a big part in creating a divide. Like any other topic they cover they continue to try and split our country.

Makes me think about why they are constantly trying to divide us. Do they feed on the hostility it causes? Does it give them higher ratings? Or is there some conspiracy theory about the government controlling the media to easily take complete control of the citizens?

Oh, I'm laughing so hard. "...Parenting has become a full-contact competitive sport." That's making my day. Thanks, Karen M!

But this site, among others (including places not online, such as the school pickup lane and the block party) serves as a "back fence" over which mothers talk about this and that. The good thing about it is that some people genuinely benefit from the interaction. The bad thing is that the more talking people do, the more opinionated they get. They make up labels, or latch onto the many labels they read about and hear about, and all of a sudden the labels become so important! People even think and evaluate in terms of those labels. Does this remind you of anything? High school, maybe?

It's nothing new. It goes on in every generation. We all like to brag on our kids, if we can - well, at least I did - and we like to think maybe we're doing things fairly well. But there is a point at which the main focus becomes the mamas and not the children.

When I had babies, I had a wonderful doctor - a G.P. He said, "Everybody's going to tell you how to raise your children. Smile and tell them thank you, and then get on the phone and call me." How wonderful that was!

If I were raising children again (mine are all adults), I'd want to detach myself from the conversation/comparison groups, turn off the TV and the computer, and just do my best. If I needed help or advice, I know the individuals - not groups or sites - where I could get trustworthy advice. The jabbering and the labels use up time and energy that I could better spend reading aloud to the children or getting the laundry done.

Thank you ChristyLee for your service. You are an awesome Mom!

I don't remember there being competitions when I was young and my mom stayed at home with us, though I'm sure there were, just different kinds.

What kind of mom am I? The best mom in the world! The best mom for my 3 kids. No one can raise them better than I do...love them, guide them, teach them, etc...for me to do that, I have a whole team of cheerleaders and supporters.

My husband, my parents, my siblings, my fabulous babysitter, my neighbors, my kids teachers, coaches, my bosses, etc...hasn't it always been that way?

Whether working or stay at home, it takes an army to raise a kid or kids.

But me? I'm a rockstar mom...my kids even made my iPad and iPhone call me rockstar :).

I don't think we ever stopped. That's just my opinion, but as an example, recently I was planning an out-of-town trip (a girls' weekend, no kids). I reached out to a few friends to ask if one of them could possibly watch my kids for several hours on Monday when my husband was at work, since I wouldn't be home until around noon. They ALL said yes. Likewise, when a friend of mine recently had a family crisis and called me to ask if I could take her daughter for a few days, I agreed without hesitation. I should add that my group of mom friends includes SAHMs, WOHMs, WAHMs, and just about any other label you can think of. Some are conservative, some are liberal, some are religious, some are atheists, some homeschool, some public school, some unschool! I don't think any of us thinks of the others as labels. We are just moms and friends. I think the more you look for divisions, the more you'll find them.

Hmmm...Where do I start?

I must be in the minority here, but I really don't feel that divide in my "real" life until I get on this site (NOTHING against this site, love it, but this the only place in my life there is ever a real distiction made or discussion about a SAHM vs WOHM).

Many of my friends are attorneys. Most of my very close female friends are not; they simply stopped at college. One is a weather girl, one stays home, another is a nurse, one is a banker, and still another an attorney. None of us have EVER discussed the idea that one has it harder than the other or one set of kids will do better than the other.

What I have discussed with my friends is the fact they are poisoning their children by feeding them McDonalds four times per week. This particular mom complained to me about not having enough time to cook. I said look, if I can work 50 hours per week, plus a side job and have children to cook for, so can you. It doesn't have to be 5 courses - just not poison. I didn't say it exactly like that, but you get the idea. It is my OPINION that allowing that type of food into the body of someone who knows no better and is your responsibility is poisoning them (it really is, research it). I prefer organic, but that doesn't mean I would push that preference on to somoene else. I will, however, chime in when I feel I can offer some knowledge to someone clearly ignorant (if she doesn't realize how bad mcd is for her kids, hopefully it is ignorance). And by the way, we are still really good friends.

I also will chime in with an opinion when a friend (happens to be the same poisoner above) calls to complain how she just lost her job and they cannot pay their bills. This particular family lived paycheck to paycheck despite making $120k per year. Had to keep up with the Jones' and had too much debt. I had told her for years it was a very bad idea to live that way, that we make a lot more than them and drive paid for cars and live in a less expensive home and don't eat out to prevent a future money disaster. She never listened.....

I think it is pretty clear that my family makes better choices than hers. That then qualifies me to be a judger. =)

I may be nuts, a mean person, whatever you want to call it, but when you make bad choices for your children, I do expect some sort of justification to come along with that. I guess that is just me. Eg, "I fed my kid McDonalds six nights in a row because their dad was in the hospital and that was our option at the time", not, "I fed my kid Mcd each night because I was too lazy to cook". I judge lazy. Why? Because I am in the SAME position! I am tired, I am overworked, I want to not cook. But I do, because that is what is best for my kids. So my thought is, if I can do it, so can you. (Sans the exceptions, of course, in extreme circumstances such as hospitalization). So I think a lot of my judgment applies when I think people are making excuses. And I don't judge until I know the facts (or I hope I don't at least).

I guess I just cannot wrap my head around any type of "judgment" based on the simple "status" of a mom - working or non. WHAT that mom does makes me judge them. You can be the BEST mom and stay home with little Billy and teach him every language under the sun and he may still turn out to be a dope. Then there are moms who work full time, are able to provide their children with lots of different opportunites because of that extra income, and their children may turn out to be dopes, too!

Why does it make you judgmental to tell someone about studies that have PROVEN breast milk is best for the baby? I breastfed for many reasons. If I come across a mom who says "eww gross, I would never let a baby touch my nipple that is SO nasty", yes, I will judge her. I will judge her ignorance, and I will find it strange that a mom would think that way. That doesn't make me a bad person. It makes me human. Of course I think my decisions are the best ones, or else I wouldn't have made them.

But like I said, I have never noticed the divide in my "real" personal life...only on here. And I really don't even notice it being that big of a deal on here.

Quite frankly, I think moms are envious of the others in a different position. Do I turn a little green when the stay at home mom who has one kid and gets to work out every day and shop and hasn't a care in the world (well, other than just minor real life cares) talks about her amazing life?! You bet I do. But then I see her complaining about her husband who cheated, and she only has one child compared to the 3 I have been blessed with, and her mom just died of cancer, and her child was just in trouble at school....and I realize, I may not have it so bad after all. We always want what we don't have. I would love to stay home, but I also love my career. I try to find a balance, and I judge when it is appropriate....=)

ETA: And I guess I just disagree with the fact that each mom has the title "I want what's best for my kids". I know lots of moms, unfortunately, who do things the easy way, or the selfish way, or ______(fill in the blank) way and that in turn causes the children to be at a disadvantage. Moms who shop way too much and buy things they don't need in lieu of funding their kid's college or paying off family debt. Moms who drag their kids into a divorce mess because they are still in love with the cheating soon-to-be ex. I could go on. My point is that I do judge the MOTIVE behind a mom, not her title. Don't we all?

ETA: I must be missing something about this media discussion as well - how does the media try to divide us again? I don't watch much TV and if I do, it definitely isn't the typical American shows - I will be watching some history channel documentary - lol, so maybe that is why I am at a loss here.

I think that maybe I don't fully understand the question. I've never thought of mothers in terms of labels or types. I've always been a "mothering" person, even well before mine. I always imagined that I would be so mindful of everything, because that is how I'm made. I'm not a helicopter or a tiger (and those labels are meant to be harsh and critical); I just parent--and "mother"--in the way that I think is best. It is not a judgment for or against the way that anybody else does it, because I assume that they are all doing what they think is best, based on who they are and where they've been and what they've learned. Even when I don't fully agree with what somebody else is doing, I recognize her right to do it. Further, I recognize her right and need to get her own legs in this thing. If we are to trust our gut, then our parental gut has to be trained. We have to have space for trial and error so that we learn to trust the bond between mother and child. I support those efforts.

I don't really agree.
The moms of the "pack" my kid runs in are very diverse.
Some work, some don't.
Some cook, some don't.
Some are rich, some are struggling.
Some are social climbers, some are content.
Some are neat freaks, some aren't.
Some are homebodies, some are social butterflies.
Some would be friends if our kids weren't friends, some wouldn't.
The common denominator is that we are "the moms" right?
I think you can acknowledge a fact or a dofference or a similarity and not get judgey about it.
That's a whole other ballgame!

I don't think it's just defining types of moms..that same type of competition happens in all aspects and phases of life, just with different labels. Part of the reason is because humans like to categorize. Part of it is because everyone feels an inherent need to be involved or included in groups they feel they can identify with. They're inevitable situations for competition to arise..SOMEONE has to be the best, right?

Whether someone else tries to define you or you define yourself to others, there's going to be judgment, assumption, etc. It's the world we live in. I believe the go-go-go attitude has contributed; the consumer belief that "stuff" defines your status; the idea that every kid gets trophies and ribbons and is special and entitled to everything; and the people who see all of this and believe that they're not good enough and must keep up.

Or, you could just choose to not fall into that.

I don't think when you actually know people we try to define each other all the time... It's natural just to think "oh, she stays home or she works." It's like noticing hair color. Doesn't have to be a judgement. So I think a lot of it is just the media. But it's also human nature. I know my mom didn't like some other moms when I was a kid. She'd think one was "weird' or something. Maybe it was bc that mom breast fed until her child was 4 and my mom didn't think that way... It's just human nature to befriend people who you share some common beliefs with... And don't we define men too somewhat? One husband is "ambitious", another isn't. One husband is "successful", another isn't professionally. Men have this pressure too. Can't we all look at men who work as "doing their best to support their families?" Sure. But some do it better than others! Hard not to notice... Some mothers are lazy. I'm not sure all are really doing the best they can. Aren't some women just really self centered? Don't we see posts from women who have bad relationships with their mothers bc they were lousy mothers? I think it's natural to notice that. But with the women I know, we support each other just like you said your group did. My kids are much younger. I don't feel like we really define what type of moms were are but it's a fact we are different types of moms... No getting around that. Sometimes noticing differences can lead to learning something new. I think there's a difference between judging and noting someone's lifestyle.

I want to send a flower for your question :)

I am so glad to see you moms talking about the competitiveness. There is one mom I have known since birthing classes, yea, a looong time. She is so flipping competitive that I actually run the other direction to get away from her when I see her coming. You know those frenemy things that only another mom can say about your kid...that kind of stuff.

I will say that once I recognized it, I became able to let it go much more easily. Still, I try to avoid contact in this sport at all costs. What I am really loving is seeing a lot of the kids I have known since they were babies turn into great young adults. They were raised by all kinds of moms...married, single, working outside the home, stay-at-home, straight, gay, divorced....you name it. Each of these kids is special, none of them are perfect, not even my own, but I think they are all really wonderful people. That is our job as moms....raise our kids to be good people, but also let them be who they are meant to be, not some accomplishment or measure by which we choose to judge ourselves.