Too-Heavy Cheerleader

You sound like you are a great coach! And you are so kind to not point out her weight. You are doing the right thing. I would just tell her that every member has a certain job on the squad, and her job is base or spotter, period. Tell her maybe next year she can be a flyer. Keep up the good work.

It sounds to me that you are doing it the right way.
You are right, you should not tell her the truth - EVER.

Just tell her that you have given it great thought and that you think that it is best for her to stay as a dancer / spotter / base cheerleader.

And then leave it at that.
That way you can let her know so that she is not left to believe that someday soon she will get to fly.
She will need to know so that she can come to terms with it or make other arrangements that will make her happy.

I wish you the best with everything and keep up the good work.

All she wants to do is fly, and the fat little girl in me cries out for her, is there any way you could find the time/funds to take her somewhere special to "fly" I think she knows she is too big, but her mother may not be helpful in many ways and may need an adult to help her out. I know some gyms have rigs that they use to work with the fliers (5young cheer girls in the family HEAVY comptition), or maybe a large trampoline, something anything to help give her that sensation. And talk to her honestly about what body types are good for what and why hers is sooooo important to the team. Honestly she is the lifeline to the team w/out her no one goes up in the air, w/out her no one gets caught and stays safe, w/out her we are just ok as a squad. But to be a GREAT Squad we need all different kinds of body types. Be the adult she NEEDS you to be is what the fat kid in me is begging for.

I was a competitive cheerleader for 5 years. Being 4'11 and 95 lbs, I was the flyer. It was no question that some were more suited for fliers and others as bases. I was awful at tumbling... I left that to the girls who had it mastered, and the team worked around each girls best traits... though we did after competitions and down times spend time experimenting with other spots for fun.

I think reminding her that you are focusing on her best traits for the team, such as her strong base and dancing skills is really where you need her. For instance , in football a linebacker and a quarterback have totally different purposes (and usually bodytypes) and the team would not work as well if they switched places.

It's sad that it has come to this though, that she isn't getting it, even though her bases fall every time they try and get her up... I'm guessing it could be pressure from her mom. Just tell her that the smaller girls are easier to lift because the bases are not that strong yet, and that for safety's sake, she isn't ready yet to be a flier b/c she hasn't mastered being able to come down without flailing her arms and legs, bearing her weight during the take off and maintaining her balance. I use to practice these things and adding in heelstrecthes and scorpions at home on a barstool.

When we first started cheering, we all had to do basic stunts, like the L stands on the thighs and such for safety. We had to do the most basic things and master them and sign off on them on a sheet before we were allowed to advance to the next stunt with a bit more difficulty. Perhaps implementing something like that would be helpful.

It's also about technique, not just weight. We had one heavy flier, but she was solid, held her weight really well in her upper arms and actually flew up fairly easily because she had great technique, pinched her butt and had great balance, though her landings were pretty rough and she had a hard time bouncing out of the holds into new stunts or jumps because of that.

Here is a pretty good response to that to help her with the weight bearing as a flier (scroll down for the answer):

http://en.allexperts.com/q/Cheerleading-2239/Helping-Flye...

If you need to get her up, to say a half extension (no way to try a full with her), you can always throw in 4 bases, with a 5th there holding up one of the main sides. The bases really need to have their bearings and keep their arms close to their chests.

If you do a cheer for a game, let her be in a front and center stunt, even if it is just a little thigh stand like this, using a back base as well, and then you can have more complicated stunts forming a pyramid around her as the fliers connect arms:
http://www.ksd.k12.ky.us/Athletics/images/Back%20to%20Bas...

Or, you can let her do a little dance during the stunt, part of the cheer, maybe with 3 dancers and her in the middle front so she still feels like center stage.

In the long run, if you try all this, she still persists and she's not progressing on the practices, simply tell her you are going to be working on the safer stunts that the bases can handle for the time being. Ultimately safety is more important than hurting someone's feelings. Tough, but that's the way it is.

I fell flat on my back in the middle, halfway straddling my back base who hit the floor of the Mavericks stadium coming out of a basket toss... because the stunt was thrown backwards instead of straight up and when I got out of that stunt, I went straight into my next stunt and finished the cheer and straight into a dance, but I had tunnel vision, pain and couldn't remember any words to the cheer so I just smiled. I can only imagine, an untrained heavier flier falling on a smaller base and how much more dangerous that could be for both of them. I've had back problems ever since.

As for the mom, don't include her as much. She may be nosy and bossy and mean, but try not to let her run the court. Maybe have a parent pow-wow about being supportive and team players, and supporting the girls and that would let her know that you are on to her.

You are in a tough spot. I am a cheer mom, President of the boosters and work closely with the coaches. We work with 14-16 yr olds.

In all likelihood, this cheerleader knows her limitations.

I think you are doing a great job and praising her for being a strong base. I'd let her know she is in a valued spot because she helps with safety.

You can't risk someone getting hurt.

Our squad does not have enough strong bases this year. the majority of the girls are smaller and great flyers.

Our coach and competition trainer assign the spots. Everyone does not get to fly. Each stunt group is set and might vary with 2 flyers. Other than that, it is all set so they will be consistant.

I agree to not talk to a nasty cheer mom. We have a couple of those as well.

Keep encouraging this girl and praising her great base ability and maybe she'll accept her spot soon.

Good luck..

this is a hard one. is there any way you can include a bit of a nutrition lesson to your girls. Nothing major but maybe a five minute talk with a goal . Like There was a study that kids get 40% of their calories from junk foods. maybe tell the girls you dont want them to be like that ( I mean lets face it i bet half the thin girls eat as crappy as she may, but their genes are just different) Maybe set a goal that they eat one more piece of fruit a day then they already are, then one more veggie serving at lunch. something? I am sure you can find great idea online. then you would really be making a difference for all the girls!

Why not sit the whole squad down and talk about healthy eating habits and the safety of the squad. Tell them that the rules are put in place for safety reasons.

Also, point out that the healthier they eat, the better they will feel. And that it is not about being a size 2, or looking like a model, but that they are athletes, and they need to think about how they are taking care of themselves. Any trained athlete is on a diet or health regimen, and being the aunt of a champion cheer captain, I can assure you that these girls will have harder times down the road if they do not stay on top of their game. My neice is on a really great squad, and one of the pre-requisites for every girl on the squad is that they must be able to do a standing back tuck!

Your duty as a coach is to include everyone who wants to be there and cheer, but when these girls get a little older they will have to deal with the harsh reality of tryouts and cuts, so maybe it is in this girls best interest to tell her that you want her to work on the things you know she is good at, and help her become even better at those things, and leave the flying to the girls who are experienced in that area.

I can understand feeling bad for her, but if you exaplin the healthy eating habits and don't see any change, then you can tell her down the road that she isnt trying to do what you asked of her, and that because of that she has to remain a base.

Hope it helps, good luck

Before you even said that about her mother, I knew that -just knew that. My advice, tell the nasty cheer mom to leave her daughter alone. She should back off. Build her daughter up. I have seen how some of these sports parents destroy their children, we live in a community where they decided to get these people off the field. Its so sad and the parents were swearing at their children and calling them stupid. Continue to tell the little girl the same things. I do not know how old this group is so I cannot determine a great way to help other than addressing the entire group about how important it is to eat correctly. We can all benefit from a reminder of that.

You could say that the other girls are too small and or young to be able to safely support her right now, but that things may change in future years as everyone grows up. I have a petite child and would be very concerned about her supporting a too heavy person.

I've been a competitive cheerleader (high school and college), as well as a cheer coach for girls in this same sensitive age group, and I can SOOO sympathize with your dilemma. And you sound like you have a WONDERFUL head on your shoulders and insight into your situation. And you have really handled this in the best way you can, I think.

Like someone else suggested, it sounds to me like this girl probably does know the reason she isn't a flyer. Kids are far more perceptive and intuitive than we often give them credit for. But she is also still innocent and enthusiastic enough to want to try, bless her heart... not to mention, it really is fun. :)

But you definitely have to lean on the side of safety, and also of what makes sense. I applaud you for allowing her to 'try' flying, but in reality, she is going to have to remain as a base or a spotter.

So, how do you handle that? Do you think you could sort of reframe your explanation to her in such a way that doesn't necessarily point out her weight/strength in relation to being a base, as much as point out that the smaller girls "arent' big/strong enough to be bases"? Take the focus off of her, and make the smaller girls the focus of the explanation, but basically saying the same thing? But you've probably done this already...

I agree that I'd avoid doing anything potentially psychologically damaging at all cost. And with her mom being a psycho cheer mom, I'd definitely steer clear of involving her in your explanation at all. I do like the idea of handing out a list of "expectations" for the cheer moms, i.e. positive attitudes, positive words to the girls, acceptable behavior at practices/games, etc. Naturally, I wouldn't single her out, but maybe she'd get the message if everyone got the list... (in reality, the non-psycho cheer moms will be the ones who take it to heart, and it will probably go right over psycho cheer mom's head, but I'd still try...)

I imagine you're probably working on a routine, or cheers that involve the stunts you are practicing. I'd just get your stunt groups formed, and continue to emphasize that your groups need to practice in those groups, and continue to emphasize the importance - and fun - of all positions. If she asks you again to try flying, I'd just tell her that at the beginning of the year, it was ok to let everyone try out each job to see who was best at what, but now that you know who does what best, you will be working on making everyone the best they can be in that position. I just wouldn't entertain letting the girls try out different things for fun at this point.

As an aside, I was a base on my squad. And not because I was one of the biggest girls on the squad, but because I was SO STRONG, and there were smaller girls than me, and girls who were just better at the flying than I was. And I LOVED being a base. All my life, people always commented on how strong I was, in dance, in cheerleading... I was just always really strong. And I loved that about myself. It was a real source of self esteem for me. And I LOVED that me and my basing partner, although totally average sized girls, could base better than anyone on our squad. Anytime we tried new things, she and I were ALWAYS the ones to try it first, because we could be counted on. And thank you for the opportunity to think back and remember that. What good memories... SOOOO, I'd just try to emphasize her strength, show her that you rely on her for that. And let her know how important she is to the squad (which I can see you already do...) Just keep up the wonderful job.

Eventually, she WILL figure out that she is too heavy to be a flyer. In the meantime, point out that when you've tried those stunts, the bases are struggling/collapsing, so her technique is not on par for a flyer, and while you applaud her enthusiasm, you simply cannot put her and the other girls in danger. I would remind her that in every sport, not every player is suited for every position.

About the mom.
It might be helpful if you make a list of "rules".
Maybe you already have such a list . . .
practice hours, preparation, etc.
But also "rules" regarding your expectations of the kids,
regarding decisions of who gets to do what, etc.

Include in there some specific remarks about your expectations of parents' behavior and attitudes toward you and your girls. Include items -- which may be obvious to everyone else -- about encouraging and praising the girls. It may be that this is the only mom who acts this way. If you print this up and give it to all the moms, maybe the mom will recognize herself in there and back off. Poor kid.

Afterthought: You can probably tell this kid how important bases are,
and how responsible spotters need to be. That you value her for these important roles she plays and how well she does them.
You could even point out, carefully, that the girls who "fly"
are usually the smaller girls; maybe make a comparison w/gymnasts.

I just re-read your description and stopped at "today she asked me why"
Y'know . . . . I'll bet she knows. Especially if she's tried before
and the bases fell down underneath her.
Maybe, what with her mother's pressure, etc.,
maybe she needs someone to actually tell her the truth.
???
I don't know.
I admire how you're trying hard to do the right thing.
=============================

I apologize for the repetitions here.
I appreciate your concern about this girl's psychological wellbeing
but, y'know . . . . maybe truth is the better option.
And I wonder if you can help rein in her mother.
Good luck.

First off from a person who was a heavy kid and now adult, she and evey other person out there knows of their own weight issues and don't need any reminders from others. Her weight issue sounds like it stems from home issues so don't go there as it will be turned against the child. As for the desire to fly. Assign positions and let the group know as a whole that there will be no changes as you as coach will make the best decisions you can to ensure they are the best team possible with both show and safety in mind. Ther won't be changes unless you see someone be weak in a certain area. Also to the whole team let them know that you need them to be as healthy as possible so they can have good stamina and prevent injury and this includes lean meats, fruits, veggies and to cut down on pop chips and drink water instead. Let them know everyone has a responsibility to the team to be the best in their part of the team that they can be.

Oh boy......poor you!!! I would just have to tell her you are the coach and you decide where each girl needs to be. I would tell her that her that she is the best at spotting and that where she will stay. I would tell her that there are flyers that could never do her part because their strength on the team is being a flyer. If mom has a problem with that to bad. You have to think of the danger all the girls would be in. What if they dropped her on her spine. Your doing the right thing.

Tell her that you know she wants to fly but that the squad really needs her to be a spotter and help build a strong base...she is irreplacable in those positions. Tell her that the base is just not strong enough to support the fliers if she is not there with them and then it would not be safe.

Encourage good nutrition and excercise for all and see if that helps w/ her weight.

Could you discreetly talk to her dad?

You sound like a WONDERFUL coach. Hugs to you.

My first thought is this: I'm a 6 foot tall ex competitive gymnast. Rather, I was competitive, until I got too tall to stay competitive (rotation). Several years later, low and behold, diving I *wasn't* too tall for, and it used my gymnastics training to the hilt. Both sports are "flying" sports. Do her showcase stuff across the front and then leap into base to support and then be dancing and then more gymnastics moves, with the others out front, etc?

This little girl may always be too big to fly, or she may be chubbed up for puberty and will lean out naturally in a few years. Regardless... if she could get into gymnastics she may not be flying for the team... but she COULD be doing handsprings & arial somersaults in the next couple years. Which are as sexy showcase positions to be in as the fliers, yes?

(It would also get stage mum off your back if you talked with her about how her daughter's innate strength and desire to fly puts her into a league of her own... if she could get some gymnastics training. ALSO that diving training would train her inner ear AND teach her the body motions for tricks YOUNG, while the other "weaker" girls got their height and strength... so that by the time she hits highschool and college where the guys are helping base, and the weaker girls have her daughters strength and are JUST learning... she could be a true star. Meanwhile, continuing to cheer... she'd get the solid foundation in this sport. Of course, it would mean extra classes for your daughter at other facilities -diving class & tumbling class- in addition to cheer...)

I've found nothing works better on stage moms that stroking their ego (aka their child's praises) while giving them "extra credit" options... which in turn leads to happier KIDS, because they actually get a chance to learn to excel in what those strengths are.

Hugs. Stage mom's drive me nuts.

Oooh -you are in a bad place! I used to be a cheer coach a million years ago, and I luckily had all waifs (we had a problem with bases), but I know what you mean about the moms! It sounds like she may do a number on her daughter about the girl's weight if you mention it to the mother, so don't go there. I think you need to have a private, casual chat with the girl soon, and just explain to her that there are different body types suited to different things. Never mention her weight, per se, but just tell her that taller (is she taller?) bigger-boned or larger framed people can get really hurt if smaller people are trying to pop them up or support them at a height and the smaller people can really get hurt too. Reiterate that she's your BEST spotter/base, and you desperately need a really good one like her, or the stunts just aren't going to work. Tell her you depend on her, and you really need her there and as a dancer because the team wouldn't be nearly as good without her doing those things. Hopefully this will bolster her and give more of a sense of purpose. Good luck -that is a hard place to be in!

i think you should focus on each girl's strongest abilities and leave it at that. you have given each girl a chance to do each job, and you know who fits best where. let her know that she is so great at what she does, and there are other girls that are good at the flying, that its your job to place the team according to their strongest abilities. you may have to be firm with her but just let her know that you're the coach and you know what's best for each team member. and keep lavishing the praise. it sounds like this little girl has a tough road ahead of her self-esteem wise. good luck!

My son's soccer team is 8,9, 10 year olds and this is the first year that they haven't rotated positions. The coach puts them int he position they are strongest at to start getting them ready for when they start middle school and have try outs. Maybe time to have a chat with the girls that soon they will reach they age where not everyone gets to by part of the squad so its time to start focusing on the skill they are best at. Also discuss with the team the benefits of healthy eating and how you will get sick less and feel better if you eat right.
I don't know if you get to pick your squad like our town does for our sports at this age but I know someone that coaches that clashed so bad with one mom in baseball that he refused to have that child on his soccer team and not because of the child but because of the mom. If the mom says or complains to you about her daughter not getting the chance to fly then you need to mention to the mom your safety concern for the other girls and her daughter. You don't want to see anyone get hurt.

Talk to her parents.

That's tough. I was a cheerleader from kindergarden to college. We always had heavier girls on the squad but they recognized their limitations and it was never an issue. Maybe you could try to practice a lift routine with her to show her that it wouldnt work? Good luck.

How about saying (if she brings it up again) I have everyone in the position that they are best in & that is how it is going to stay. I do not want to have this conversation again. You don't have to tell her why. You are the coach & you make the best decisions for the team. You may have to stop letting the others switch out also just to be fair. Assign their positions & be done with it. Don't bring up anything about her size & continue to tell her what a good job she does in her position.

This is a tough one because they are so young. Childhood obesity is a major problem and this child is young enough to get a handle on it before she get to the grades where they really start to tease her about her weight and children won't care about how it makes her feel. They will just flat out say you are too fat for me to be trying to pick you up. I would ask the Mom what is she doing to help her daughter slim down since talking about her is not working. Then maybe the school has a social worker that could give you some suggestions on how to talk to the child since the mother is so ignorant. Maybe as a group you could say we are all going to work on eating healthier and taking care of our bodies and teach them all about good eating habits and exercise without it being about just her and all the children will learn and become healthier and better cheerleaders. It is so sad that her mother would talk about her when she is the one that should be helping her.

why don't you contact her mom and tell her? its a pretty simply concept to understand the "lighter" girls are on top and the "stronger" girls are on the bottom and they don't really work correctly or safely the opposite way. Good luck!

oops, i just saw that you said the mom isn't nice. then i would say something to the girl along the same lines....you are stong so you need to be on the bottom and you are SO GREAT at it and we need you there. Then say I understand you want to be a flyer but really the other girls are not strong enough to support you. That way you put it on the other girls and not on her. Sorry i didn't read your prior responses so you may have gotten this advice already. good luck!!!

I may be off track on this one but please hear me out. The little girl has a dream of flying like other team mates, her mother seems to be the one that is pushing her to constantly ask about flying, the coach continues to be nice and change the subject with other positive coments about being the base and spotter and the little girl is frustrated as to why she can't do it. Yes she has tried to climb to the top with all of the other girls struggling to hold her up but she does not see or feel that all she wants to do is fly. I feel your pain for safety.

You have talked about how to "skirt" the issue to not damage her psyche. Has anyone really gone over flying technique with her so that she really undestands what she has to do and had her practice it really well? Is there another team that she can be placed on that has larger sized girls so that she could try out? I remember ballet class and me being the "big chubby" girl with all these little waifs. It did not do anything for me other than help me stretch my legs.

Sometimes we can't be what we want and we most be told that it is not for us. Are there any track clubs or gynamstic clubs that she can go to? If not you are just going to have to be honest with her that this part of the sport is not for her. Otherwise she is going to keep asking to fly. I know life is not fair and we need to shield our children from life but life sucks and it does hit you in the face. All we can do is be there to help with the fall and move on and learn from the experience.

I hope that you can come up with a way to tell her so that she does not continue to "nag" you to fly. The best to the team.

The other S.