What Would You Do? - Cherryville,MO

S.-

No one can predict whether or not you and hubby are 'destined to fail'...

I would suggest counseling for you both NOW!! The problem with most marriage and family counseling is that many couples begin when one (or both) are no longer emotionally invested 'in' the marriage. It often is a last ditch effort where one spouse has the attitude of 'well this probably won't help'...and lo and behold...it doesn't!!

A good marriage and family counselor can not only provide good parenting tips...but also help you both to work thru some differences and assist in some good communication techniques...

Do it now...before you are really 'IN' a crisis...

Big Cyber Hugs!!
michele/cat

Something Tracey K said really exploded to me when I read it & I think she read a line of your question incorrectly. She said that her husband, like your husband, believe that the key is for the child to fear the consequences. Now, I 100% agree with that philosophy & it is the precise way my husband & I parent HOWEVER, it's not what you said about your husband. He wants the kids to fear him personally, not the consequences & that's where the screw-up lies. Once he can get that through his thick skull I think you'll all be a lot happier.

Excellent Question! I'm going through that decision process right now. I'm at a point where, I have to decide whether I can live with something that isn't likely to change. Is it something I can accept or is it a deal breaker? I really haven't decided yet. I know it will always be a problem and I will always push back on it. And, I know he will never change the offensive behavior. Part of that decison is - am I better off with or without him and are the kids better off with or without him? I haven't really decided that either. My life is so hectic, I rarely get quiet time to reflect. But, I weigh pros and cons almost daily.

To answer your direct dilemma, My husband is much more strict than I am. I frequently think he goes a bit too far. He always thinks I am too soft. Well, the proof is in the pudding. My kids love and respect thier daddy deeply. They love me, but they run over me. I can't handle them in public by myself. They frustrate me to no end, because they do stuff they never do when dad is around. All the time outs, consequences, stern looks, stern but compassionate talks in the world don't make a dent. Dad pops thier butt, whereas mom talks till shes blue in the face. The pop is much more effective. He, like your husband, also thinks kids need to fear the consequences. It sounds bad when you say they need to fear him. It's the consequences that they fear.

I think, it is time that maybe you think about signing both of you up for a parenting class. Not because you need a class in how to parent! But, so that you can have an impartial 3rd party expert say things. Your husband will put more weight behind it and act as though it's the 1st time he's heard things that you say to him daily! FUnny how that works. It may also suprise you to hear that your husband may be more right than he is wrong.

Fear is imposed... respect is earned. It's not about "lightening up". If he's an intense person, he can't change that. It's more about changing his purpose in discipline. If he's telling you flat-out that he is unwilling to change that you have to decide for yourself what that means.

For some people that means talking openly with your children about why daddy is the way he is... be honest (not judgmental or accusatory) with them. Daddy does XYZ because he grew up that way. I know that he can be scary, but he loves you and wants you to grow up to be respectful and responsible.

For some people it means turning a blind eye at the time and the coddling later- undermining no doubt!

For some it means realizing that you simply cannot share a household.

There are other options, I'm sure but it's up to you to decide. Don't jump to any decisions. He may be saying that he won't change b/c he won't admit to doing something "wrong", but in all reality he may make some minor adjustments.

Good luck.

Those that control by fear only do so because they cannot control though respect. Err unless you don't want to insult him then try something else.

The end result any parent wants is a relatively well behaved child that treats others with respect. Controlling through fear shows a lack of respect to the child. It is not the same type of respect that a child has for an adult, it is the respect of the autonomy of the child. They are a human being capable of all the feelings and thoughts of an adult, they just can't control them. To properly learn a child must learn to respect their own inborn abilities. They cannot do that when all they are doing is avoiding your husband knowing they have done wrong.

Too wordy?

Okay, just my experience but his style of parenting shows a general dysfunction. It will not go away without therapy. I would imagine it spills over into a lack of respect for you but I am guessing there. Most likely he doesn't feel respected in work and even socially so he is demanding respect from his family. He needs help.

You know my answer.

Maybe test the waters so to speak with that. : ) You know... a few days, week... whatever. Get a reaction. Stir the pot. : )

I think one of the cornerstones of any relationship is compromise. If I was married to a man who vehemently refused to budge on an issue as important as this one...then for the safely of me and my children, I would leave. I have come to realize lately that life is to short to be unhappy. You say that he states he will call the cops or his parents to prevent you from leaving? Let him. If he is so bull-headed as to not compromise then he has really left you no choice. You should not be the one who constantly bends and turns the other cheek. That just turns you into a doormat. Then when your kids get older, they will also treat you like a doormat because that is the example that was set for them. Ask him to get into some sort of counseling. That is the very least that he could do.

Good luck in handling this.

Parenting is so hard... and maintaining a relationship while parenting is even harder.

Reading your post and SWH troubles me greatly, S.. If you think that your husband's parenting style is a problem then it is!!! Regardless of what he thinks. You have the right to express your feeling about how he's treating them and for him to hear you. That's what marriage and parenting is about.... listening to each other, hearing each other, respecting each other, working together. And also, by the way, he's wrong... the way to manage kids is not by fear. Why in the world would he ever think that this is ok??

Try to get him to go to marriage and family therapy with you. At least there you'll be able to talk safely with someone present and you might be able to get the to root of the problem. I'll be really honest... there's NO WAY that I could accept this and stick it out. It's way too far from what I believe is right and healthy for my kids.

I'm worried for you, girl... if he won't go to therapy, I think you should go by yourself. Sending you a hug~ Good luck

Hi S.- I looked over your posts this morning and they are a little concerning. It seems like it's more than just different parenting styles that is causing problems in your family. If your husband refuses to really listen to you and your concern over how he parents that's a marital problem. He should respect your opinion to the point that he really examines himself.
From your posts you don't seem like and unreasonable person or like you have constant copmplaints about things he needs to change. If he does not really listen to what you're saying, take it to heart and work on a solution then your problems will just get worse. The problem is him, his refusal to consider he's wrong and his refusal to respect your view. Who spends the most time with the kids? Who has read the most parenting books, talked with other Moms about discipline, received more advice on Mom themed websites;)? Is it unreasonable for him to consider that he is wrong and his harshness is a damaging thing? From what source does he get this information that children must fear their parents to be well behaved?
If YOU, the one person in the world he's supposed to trust, cherish and respect above ALL others, think something is wrong with how he parents why isn't that enough for him to consider that you're right and reflect on what he could do differently?
BTW you can tell him the money thing is a phase, both my girls went through it when they were little. At some point they firgure out money is a big deal and sometimes try to use it in inappropriate ways. Both my girls have tried to give money away at about the same age as your boy. Both times we had a discussion about money, what it is, how we earn it, how we use it and don't give it away to friends. No big deal, no reason for yelling and tears.
I'm not sure what to tell you if he refuses to bend as the road ahead will not be pretty. Your son will grow up and remember the yelling, harshness and anger, He will not look back and say "Gee, I really resepct Dad because he yelled at me a lot and made me scared of him." He will resent him, maybe fear him or maybe look down on him. But someday soon your little boy will be a grown man and his relationship with his Dad right now will help determine what type of man he'll be and what kind of adult relationship they'll have together. Do something about this now before it's too late.

I would never tolerate my children living in fear of their dads/my husband (or ex-husband who wasn't that way either). There is a big difference between fear and respect. My current husband is a big guy, and strong as can be - but gentle as a kitten with my sons (we have one together). He is a true man imho. He leads by example, not by fear.

That's the bottom line for me.

If I were in your shoes I would be in intensive couples counseling.

Good luck.

Let me ask you this... If the two of you actually split up, how would that help? With your husband in your home with your watchful eye, you can decide when to call social services and make a report that he's being abusive. That would likely cause the two of you to split. But if you split in advance you won't be there during visits and the only thing you would be able to do is listen to your child complain. On top of that, he'd likely change his ways to a point then. He'd feel like he needs to be the FUN parent and take them out and spoil them all weekend. You'd be the one with the day to day parenting to do and end up looking like the bad guy.

I don't have a good answer for how to handle your husband. But being there to advocate for your child seems better than to split.

Have you tried talking with his mother to see if his father was this way? Again was he in the military or go to military school where this was taught? Can he butt out in the disciplining of the child and let you handle it all so it isn't an issue. I don't think this is a make it or break it of a marriage/relationship, but it is something that needs to be worked on asap in my opinoin. I feel for you as this is a difficult situation.

Wow. He's a very controlling person, isn't he?

If it were me, I would leave him. I would plan it so that we left when he wasn't home, and I wouldn't see him again until we were in court. I'd be first to file for divorce, and time it so he was served the day after I left. I'd get the best lawyer I could afford, and fight for full custody of my children.

But that's me. A lot of women would rather stick it out and try to make it work. They don't believe in divorce and all that nonsense. And they live their lives unhappily and their children are miserable and grow up to think that is the way marriage should be, and repeat the pattern. Very sad.

I wish you the best, and will pray for your decision to come soon and pray that you will be happy with the outcome.

Blessings.