My four year old son is usually a very sweet little boy. Almost unnaturally sweet, seriously, the kid starts conversations w/ anyone and will tell everyone how much he loves them. He loves to give hugs, and he makes friends super easily with other kids. Recently, he has begun throwing fits everytime he doesnt get his way, or gets scolded. *(He was never spoiled by me though, so he is use to hearing "no")* His temper tantrums can range from your usual tantrums: saying NO, kicking feet, etc; to calling whomever is punishing him hateful names ("i hate you", "loser")and hitting whoever is around him. He has hit several kids and teachers (and me), and just yesterday he even progressed to knocking down shelves and spitting.
At school they pretty much give him room to "calm his body down" and then do various things like time out and taking away certain activities like outside play or bikes, etc. I have tried EVERYTHING to curb this behavior at home. I've done time out, I've taken away toys, movie time, spankings dont phase him....nothing is working.
The even weirder thing is that once he is out of his bad mood, once he has stopped throwing a fit, he is instantly back to being all loving and playing and happy. Its literally like a switch has flipped. Plus, he "forgets" he did anything bad. He doesnt remember.
So anyway, the only thing that is really working for me at the moment is to try and get him out of his bad mood as soon as possible, by either hugging him until he calms down or trying to make him laugh. Once he lets go of his anger, then I can explain to him rationally whats wrong and he then corrects whatever the issue is (you have to take a nap/ clean up/ stop playing/ etc). But clearly his anger is kind of getting out of hand, especially at school. What can I do? What can his teachers do? Has anyone else gone through this?
*P.S. he is growing up in a completely stable enviornment, there isnt any arguments/fighting/yelling/...well, really ANY displays of anger in our house, so I dont really know where he is getting this from. We've already decided to stop letting him watch cartoons that have fighting in them (Batman, Justice League, Spiderman, etc).
Have you tried eliminating sugar and especially corn syrup from his diet? Glucose intolerance can cause that sort of jekyl/hyde behavior.
Hi J.,
There is a program called Love and Logic that I swear by. For more information see : www.loveandlogic.com. In this situation one Love and Logic response to throwing, hitting, spitting would be to sing "uh oh, looks like a little bedroom time comin' up", picking him up gently, moving him to an enclosed area that is safe. closing the door and staying on the other side, until he is quiet for 1 minute. This way he learns to begin thinking about his actions. The key is 1) saying the "uh oh....." in a empathetic/loving way (may seem hard...I know)
2) being quick....do it immediately when the behavior begins so he learns clearly what has him end up away from the people he wants to be with
3) being consistent.....same response every time and waiting for the minute of quiet
so he has time to think. When he's tantruming he's still in the arguing state and interacting with him at that point is like arguing with a drunk.
I'd also recommend looking at what times of day, people around, and other details of the experiences he's having immediately before these episodes. This will give you access to preventing the upset. He sounds like a wonderful boy and when he's angry he's communicating something that could have been heard prior to his communication reaching the level of yelling/hitting/spitting.
I'd love to support you any way that I can and invite you to call me at ###-###-####. I have used Love and Logic effectively with the children in my life. It was a new practice and I didn't succeed the first time. Now that I'm fluent in it, life with tantrums and meltdowns ROCKS! No upset for me. Just love.
B. Gilbert
Wow, it sounds like you have really been working hard at solving this problem and I commend you on your efforts. It is a difficult situation, because a child obviously can not be hurting others and property and of course needs to learn discipline over his really big feelings. I had this issue with my God-daughter (whom I helped raise) and it took a while to work out all the things that were contributing.
Some of what you are seeing is based on what is normal for a 4 yrold. It is normal to switch quickly in and out of feelings, totally normal at that age, and also normal to pretend it didn't happen. Also, it is his developmental role to figure out how he can get what he wants, which is where the emotional manipulation comes from. When that fails, he is using physical manipulation (tantrums). For more about what is normal at this age, read a short book by Ames and Haber, "Your Four Year Old". There is one for each year, they are highly recommended by parenting instructors.
Do you use natural consequences in your discipline? It sounds almost like you do, but maybe there is a slight change to your approach that could bring more effective results. Check out the book "How to Talk so your Kids will Listen and Listen so they will Talk" by Faber and Mazlish or even "Raising your Spirited Child" by Mary Sheedy Kurcinka. These are also easy readers, so you can get something from it even with the few minutes before bed.
In my experience, this is not the kind of issue that will go away overnight, and I encourage you to keep the faith and maintain your patience while you work through this, and even to get some direct support from an experienced person near you. Is there a parenting teacher near you, either in the school system, or teaching at a local community college? I think this is important.
There were two things that caught my attention with your story, and I wanted to gently point this out. One is that a four year old is too old to be spanked, and this could be exacerbating the behavior. You said he has good reasoning capability, and he could be feeling the injustice of being physically controled by someone bigger than him.
the second thing that caught my attention is, if there is absolutely no conflict occuring in your home, then he does not have a role model in which to follow, to learn how he works through dissapointment, frustration, and how to negotiate what he wants. I know that I am suggestig you change your behavior, and it is not always easy to change, but it is what made the biggest difference in the end for my God Daughter. And in no way am I implying you are a bad parent, no not at all. I encourage you in your continued efforts and admire your willingness to ask for help, because I know how frustrating it can be to deal with behavior challenges.
J.,
Sounds like a post I could have written. The same exact actions led a friend to 'tell' me to call the OT that "saved her son's life". Ok, I'm a PT and know lots of OTs, they're great people, but 'save lives'...I don't think so. Well, to make a very long story shorter, I called the OT and we've been in therapy for 1 year now for Sensory Processing Disorder (formerly known as Sensory Integration). Now I say, 'The OT saved my son's life". He has learned a few things to help him calm/organize himself...still has lots to learn.
Today I meet w/the IEP (individualized educational program) team to get him ready to start preschool next week! (doing the happy dance!!!)
As your son is already in kindergarten, I would suggest you ask the teacher/school psych for an evaluation for special education...preferably in writting as this will start the clock moving. The school will then have so many days to evaluate him by the entire team (teacher, OT, PT, SLP and psych etc). After their testing is complete they will sit and review them w/you and then you meet for the IEP.
From what you've described I would encourage you to do this.
Believe me, we've tried ALL the parenting styles, Biblical counselling etc all to no avail. There is something askew in the way his brain processes input. We've even had a behaviorist here and she saw him on a very bad day and on a very good day. She strongly feels there is something going on behaviorly that is NOT parenting related.
Sometimes spankings work, others he is either not phased by them or he screams like you're literally killing him. He screams so loud, throws EVERYTHING he can get his hands on, leaves marks on us (scratches, bites, bruises from projectiles etc) I'm surprised that no one has called the police on us.
I know I"m getting long winded here. Please know I understand, and I am living the same struggle you described. Getting these guys the help they need now while they are young will better their lives in the future. They need tools to use, and now is the time to give them. Please feel free to write me off line and I can tell you more, and give you more resources. It feels hard and almost impossible now, I know, but there is HOPE!!! Others have reached out to me and I want to reach out to you.
OH, another thing, we just found out that he is gluten intollerant. Removing it has made small changes..but then again, we are finding more and more hidden gluten so are not completely gluten free. I plan on doing another test for 96 foods in the near future as I think there are other foods his body doesn't like and could lead to his internal 'unrest' that presents itself as a 'tantrum gone bad'. Gluten and some other foods can take 24-48 to evoke a response. this is hard becuase you have to think not only about what he ate the meal prior to the episode, but for the last 24 hours..or longer. Diet changes are hard....believe me, and we're only working on gluten for now. I do believe there are others...possibly dairy and food dyes too. Once we get these nailed down and out of his system he will be happier and more content in his own body and not need to act out.
Good luck, and please know you are not alone. I and others are here for you!
M.
I think someone else mentioned this in a longer post, but I wanted to reiterate it...I would start with "Raising Your Spirited Child" by Mary Sheedy Kurcinka. She addresses quite clearly some of the ways you can help avoid and manage melt downs by explaining what is really behind how they start, and also identifies some of the subtle differences between kids with a disorder, and ones that are just spirited. Not to mention, I was just so happy to hear that my little girl was not alone, nor were we. :) Also, it is VERY easy to read, not at all preachy or text book like.
Good Luck!
K.
Hi, I have a 4 year old son who has alot of meltdowns during the day. So i think some of it maybe age appropriate. I think you are wise to take away the violent cartoons. Boys don't need any help with ideas on how to be aggressive.
For my little guy, befor he had handle on his anger i would have to get down to his level and make direct eye contact with him befor he would even know i was there. This is helpful for him to snap out of what he is going through. When he was not angery or when he was shortly out of it, i would show what was ok to do when he was angery. Like yelling into his pillow. Or saying i am mad, but we put emphasis on not hurting others and things. It takes time, but Tyler is to a place where his anger is not as bad and know he is learning to talk about what makes him mad and not just getting mad.
hope this has been helpful,.....chrissy K.
talk to his pediatrician, he may have an underlying problem and you may need to get medical attention, especially if he cannot remember what he did, and punishing him only makes him confused because he may not know what he did wrong
I would like to suggest two books. Raising Our Children, Raising Ourselves and Rasing an Emotionally Intellegent Child.
Also check out: http://www.mothering.com/discussions/
I have always told my kids that being angry is okay. It is a natural feeling, and everybody feels it at one time or another. But acting out is NOT okay. We talked about it every time they got angry and hit, or called names. Every single time. As with every other lesson, it just took time and repitition. When my husband and I get angry with each other or the kids, we try to show them good examples of how to deal with the anger, and how to talk when we calm down. It has worked with four different kids now.
J.,
Have you discussed this behavior with your pediatrician? Sudden changes in behavior can signal a physical ailment that shoudl be ruled out by a physical. Also I find that my pediatrician gives out great advice.
Otherwise don't know what to suggest.
Good luck!
J.
I'm having a similar problem with my almost 4 year old girl and am at my wits end! We've tried the same consequences you have. So I don't know if I have a magical solution for you, but here's what I'm thinking today...I think my girl is simply exhausted so she can't control herself. I'm going to try an earlier bedtime and longer naps and see if extra sleep helps her behavior. Maybe its something to try with your son too if you think it may be part of the problem. Good luck to you!
Has there been any other changes in his environment, schedule or routine?
When you can ingore the temper tantrum. Have him go to or put him in his bedroom and let him have a hissy fit. It works though it takes time. If he hits poeple time him out and him apolitize to the person he hit. This too workss though it also takes time. Afterwards see if he will talk to you about his feelings and do your best to listen and not interrupt.
Is it possible that his brain is having a chemical imbalance, perhaps from certain type of food that triggers it? Maybe this is something to check into with a pediatrician.
D.
For a kid who really has no environmental factors that could be affecting behaviour, my two guesses would be overstimulation (i.e. television, video games, etc.) which it sounds like you are addressing. The other thing I would strongly consider is aspartame, dyes (particularly red) and any other sugar substitutes. These are most often linked with hyperactivity, but can also cause episodes of rage in those who strongly react to them. Maybe if you did a trial run and removed all of these in the diet (they hide in Everything) and monitored if some of these issues change. For those who are allergic to these things, the mood usually changes pretty rapidly after consuming whatever is the culprit. Hope this helps. Much easier to change the diet than to battle a child's will. =)
My son is 4 1/2 going on 5 this year. He is also going to start kindergarten this year as well. I just recently posted a request similar to yours. I got a lot of great responses to my question. The three that made the difference the most? 1. Patience. It isn't easy, but it's something we moms work on every day of our children's lives. 2. Ignoring the bad behavior. I noticed that even though his bad behavior is completely disruptive to everyone and our environment, I took the time to immediately drop what I was doing and calmly isolate him and ignore his "bad" behavior. 3. Talking with them. I've learned that if I make it short, but easy to understand, I discuss what happened WITH my son and how WE could work together to keep it from happening again. The more you yell or stress out...the more he does. I've learned that my son mimics whatever I say/do. (I.E. pointing finger, yelling, certain words...etc.) I never realized it until one day he was spitting them back at my face. I've even had the pleasure of my son biting me in my yoo-hoo down there when he was in his biting stage. Boy, I tell ya, you've gotta have patience for that. I've adopted a "Three-Strikes-You're-Out" rule. The first time I tell him calmly that what ever he is doing is inappropriate. I allow myself to include that EVERYONE shouldn't do whatever he's NOT supposed to be doing. (Make sure to emphasis if it hurts people...etc.) Then, if that didn't work, the second time I tell him what he's doing and what is going to happen if he continues with the behavior. Then lastly, I IMMEDIATELY follow through with what I said was going to be a punishment/or reprimand. I've also realized that if it's something like picking up his room, rather than punish HIM (spanking or time out) I would punish his toys. My son has what we like to call an Tomorrow Basket, he throws his toys or doesn't listen when I tell him to put that toy away, it goes in tomorrow basket. I have set times during the day to have him pick up his things. This makes it easier for him to pick up as there isn't so many things out at the end of the day. If he doesn't pick up his toys and puts up a huge fight...his ROOM is in time out until he decides to pick it up. By age 4, he'll pick up REAL fast. (The first time we did this...he refused for 3 days! But the each time thereafter was shorter.)This way, he can be free to be in the rest of the house, but will come to realize that in order for him to be in his room, he needs to be responsible. Try talking WITH him. My son is working with his speech. This in turn, helps him to voice his feelings in a calmer and easier manner. I ask him him questions that will enable him to tell me how he's feeling, but I wait for him to calm down from a tantrum before I do this. When they throw tantrums and they become explosive, that means they have gone beyond their OWN control of the tantrum. They aren't going to listen or behave for nothing. I've learned this through my own son.
Sorry for this being so long. I really hope that this will help you in some way. I'm still going through some of this, but since I've tried these techniques, my son's behavior has improved at least 70%. I LOVE spending time with him even more and the rest of the family enjoys that smile of his. :D Good luck! :D Feel free to write me if you want to talk. I'm a single mother myself.
~B.
You gotta find a punishment that will make him think about his actions and stop.
For my daughter it was grounding her to her room and writing 'i will not....' on papers, like 3 ruled sheets - took her hours.
You've got your work cut out for you, but motherhood is never easy. I'm sure there are a lot of women here that have gone through something similar and can offer good advice.
In my opinion, a 4 year old shouldn't have ever heard the word "loser". I think you might need to be hyper-villigant about what he watches.
Good luck!
Hi J.,
I've heard a very familiar story from a woman who blogs via http://www.cafemama.com/. Her son Everett sounds almost identical in behavior to your son. While I can't explain any of it for you, I would recommend bringing your son to a child development specialist. The sooner you get intervention, the better. (On the cafemama site, scroll down and you will find some stories about Everett intermingled with other stories about food, family, etc.) Sarah might even respond to you if you send e-mail to her...although she seems to have her hands full with three children and tons of projects. Best of luck to you!
Hello there though my children are now 6 and 10 both boys - I have been thru what you are speaking about and the best advice that I can give you is read "123 Magic Effective Discipline for Children 2-12" by Thomas W. Phelan, Ph.D.
Believe me I wish I knew about this book several years back, believe me it is amazing. A three step process that the author lays out plain and simple, tells you what to expect from the child when you change to the new system and how to deal with that as well also ways to strenthen your relationship with your children. Good book- has helped me in not to talk so much. Learn the art of ignoring..
hope this will help
K.
Hi J., my daughter is 3 1/2 and sounds similar to your son. I found a book by Dr. Aletha Solter, Ph.D. and it's amazing. She's both a mom and a childhood development doctor and what she has to say has been very helpful regarding this almost schzophrenic change in the kids. I'm usually not one to run to books, but this one really does make sense and offers some great insight and ideas to survive (and continue to understand and love you child). The book is broken down from newborn tears through adolescence.
I wish you all the best. Oh, and here's a website that was linked with Dr. Solter and has an article by her. It may prove helpful.
I have a friend whose daughter was having similar outbursts and they discovered that she had a gluten allergy. Her behavior was much improved after they eliminated it from her diet. I have also heard that other foods can cause real problems for some kids (fake sugars, dyes, etc.). Also, your son sounds similar to my nephew. He has Sensory Processing Disorder. Now that he has been diagnoised, we see signs of it from when he was really small (crying at loud events, covering his ears at loud places, totally different behavior at a place like a baseball game or the mall than at home). Anyway, I would contact your doctor and get a referal for a child development specialist and a good allergist. Good Luck!
I have a 9 yr old that I would describe in much the same way-- and I think it may have started around 4 or so. I personally believe that my son has difficulty with impulse control-- something frequently associated with ADHD. My son frequently truly can't remember what he did in his "fit" and then once he has calmed down he is truly remorseful. He has been going to see a counselor for a little over a year now (although I'm not sure he would have been ready for that at 4-- and a lot of the reason behind seeing the counselor is that his dad and I were divorcing) and that has seemed to help.
The other thing we work on is once he has calmed down is to talk about what other choices he could have made. Then hopefully maybe a few times down the road he might be able to stop himself early enough and make a different choice. We even have him fill out a "problem solving worksheet" sometimes when the anger seems to be coming out way too often to really get him to focus on different choices and the consequences of each choice. I think it's also important to talk about OK ways to display anger and NOT OK ways. There are several great books available that talk about what anger is, what it feels like, etc.
Obviously, I could go on forever about this subject-- it is one near and dear to my heart! Feel free to email me back if you want anymore info or names of books/worksheets, etc. It's scary to see your (usually) sweet little guy turn into a monster! I feel for you!
