What Do I Tell My Friend Now?

I was at a kid's playnasium this past weekend. There were 2 dads there (friends of each other) whose wives were out at a baby shower. All the parents were chatting and laughing. I started talking to the dads, I made a comment that my husband was home watching the game. One actually said the following: "Yep, when the kids are with me, they can eat as much candy as they want--Their mother will learn. All it took was messing up the laundry twice and she told me I didn't have to worry about doing that anymore; she'd do it."

So, it could be that her husband truly can't take care of the kids, or perhaps he wants her to believe that...

Oh, men who can't even feed themselves ... It's a problem.
Maybe his plan was to show how incompetent he is, therefore making it his wife's fault for leaving him in charge, thus teaching her an important lesson.

But, hey, he tried to take them out and got derailed. It's hard to recover from that. I'm with my kids all the time, but getting them ready to go outside in the winter ... I'd rather stick my tongue in a light socket. But we do it anyway. And the kids recover from whatever I said through my gritted teeth and we have a great time.

She may want to break him in slowly; he could play with them in the evening while mom goes out to the store, or he could go get groceries with one of the kids while mom looks after the others. He can take everybody to the park while mom does her thing, etc., and if everybody's really good, they all get a sucker when it's time to go home. Lunchtime; open up the fridge, grab the cut-up cheese and apples. What a great dad, everybody's happy.

I wouldn't say the kids were not safe with their Dad. My husband is more gruff than I am. He tends to feed the kids junk I wouldn't feed them and they watch more TV than I allow, but they all live. I would tell your friend to do it again. The only way her husband is going to get better is by doing. Maybe she could have the kids help their Dad. If I want my husband to do something specific, I write it all out and prepare what ever it is I want him to do. I have the food all planned and a note as to what to do and when. I treat it like I would if I had a substitute teacher come in and take my place when I was teaching. I wouldn't just drop someone into a job they aren't familiar with and expect them to succeed. Sure he is their Dad, but he isn't in charge of their day to day care. It's unfamiliar territory. Cut the guy some slack. She wouldn't be able to walk into his job and succeed at it the first day.

I think a better option for her -- now that he has had a teeny tiny taste of what being a SAHM is like -- is to now get him involved on a daily basis with the children's daily routine and care. There's no reason why he can't help out after he gets home from work or on the weekend. He's part of the family and these are his children.

I actually think it's inexcusable for him not to know how to take care of his kids for a few hours here and there. But, by the same token, it's also not fair to throw all this responsibility on him without any kind of training at all and then tell him that he can't be trusted to care for the kids when he hasn't been coached properly. It's setting him up for failure. So I think the solution would be to get him more involved in the children's care on a daily basis when your friend is there so that she can be able to get out of the house every once in while also.

That's just what I think.

Keep giving him opportunities to learn how to handle the kids, but in smaller doses.

Moms don't wake up one day and automatically know how to do "everything right". SAHMs especially have days and days and days of learning what works, what doesn't, and can develop quite the arsenal of tools for when troubleshooting is necessary.

If dad hasn't spent much time with the kids and mom has always raced in to take care of it, then dads have no clue what to do. And...this is where he gets to practice. Start by having him watch one kid so he can learn how to do this man-on-man. Give him some ideas of structure, what he should make/serve for meals, and leave it at that. If she is bossy and tells him exactly what to do all the time then she may as well just stay there. Dad may do things differently - my husband is very rough and tumble with the kids and they love it whereas I'm just not that type of person - and that's okay, as long as their needs are being met and they are supervised safely.

Start small, with only one kid or with maybe an hour or two. Once HIS confidence builds, gradually work up to extended periods of time with all the kids.

And don't forget, a SAHM doesn't just wake up one day with a baby, a toddler, and a preschooler and *know* exactly what to do :)

I would tell her to cross her arms, look him straight in the eye and say:
"Well, then, that didn't work out too well, did it? Do you now see that it takes patience and skillful parenting to stay home with these kids all day? Do you now see how much work I put into keeping this house and taking care of our children without having to resort to violent punishment and lazy food choices? So what do you plan on doing to make this work out better next time? Because, darling, you see, there WILL BE a next time and you will have to learn to deal with it."

It's not her job to teach him how to parent, it's his job to figure out how he's going to learn. My husband doesn't like lists, I never made him a list. I just left when I had to. Admittedly, it started with quick trips to the store, but not for his benefit, but b/c the baby was so young I couldn't be gone that long. The longer I could be gone, the longer I stayed away, and he learned that way. Your friend's first mistake was waiting so long to do this, it should start when they are VERY young and then he would have learned to parent the same way she did, in incremental stages, learning each new developmental milestone as it came along. But, since she didn't do that, and since he's obviously delayed in his parenting abilities, he needs to figure out how he's going to step up to the plate, like I said, that's his job, not hers.

I have a three year old son, and I was a nanny for twenty years and I can tell you most dads just don't know. It's not that they don't care, they are just overwhelmed. Yes, some dad's know and mess stuff up so they don't have to anything again. I would tell your friend to sit and talk with her husband first of all. Ask him how it went, what she could do to help. Ask did he pinch and slapped their butts and yelled, or give him a chance to tell her what happened. Maybe she could tell them what she does when the kids, don't listen or act up, to give him an idea what to do for next time. First I would start with smaller steps, maybe only leaving one kid home or leaving only for an hour or two.

I leave a list for my husband, yes even after three years, he will still forgot to feed our son, or has no clue what to give him to eat. I try and make a simple schedule, leave snacks in containers with times to give to him, fill juice and milk cups and leave containers in the fridge of what to give him for lunch/dinner. If they are going out, I make sure everything is ready. Coat, shoes, bag. So all he has to do if put on socks, shoes and coat. I leave a small backpack out, so my son can take some of his toys with him in the car. If I won't be home at pj time I leave pjs out for him to put on.

I did this with a lot of the dad's I was a nanny for too. It seemed to help because it took the time off to think about other things that that had to do. I know no ones does it for me and I try to remember I am doing this to help, to make fun of or to yell at them why can't you do this. I did this for the mom's I nannied for too. I think we all prepare for things, packing diaper bags or getting dinner ready for the next night. Not everyone can be as great as we are : )

Good luck!

They need to seek counseling. If the husband is resorting to pinching and slapping instead of interacting, they need some help. Your friend needs a break and he needs to step up to the plate. That he feels that the kids are terrible is not a good sign. They are his kids and if his interactions are limited as it is, him feeling like they are terrible isn't going to help that interaction. They need to seek help before things get worse.

Maybe the thing to do is for her to first of all tell her husband thanks. I know, I know. No one tells her [us] thanks but it's what we want to hear anyway, so she can start by teaching by example. He could also decide that under no circumstance was he gonna do it again, so thanks for not saying that, either.

Then, she should also sit with her husband and talk calmly and reasonably about what he thought he did well, and what he needed help with, instead of blaming him for what he did wrong. Perhaps she can position it so they both understand it's just like any job. He can't be expected to perform well if he doesn't know the rules or have the tools. So, she can help by arming him well: if he doesn't cook, maybe pre-cook some meals and freeze them so all he has to do is thaw, heat and serve; and then leave a list of things that must be done and a suggested list of things to do.

Yes, maybe no one had to teach her all of these things but more than likely she learned by trial and error too. Why make him suffer and reinvent the wheel when she can help him to help her. If she helps him to be successful at it, he'll learn to enjoy it and actually have time and fun bonding with the kids instead of feeling like a frustrated failure. That way they all win.

It's disgusting, but somewhat common, when dad acts as an observer rather than a participant! The kids are safe, but mom needs to go back to basics with dad. Maybe she could leave for shorter time periods at first. When she leaves, maybe she can leave lunch suggestions and suggestions for activities. Hopefully, she'll only have to do it until he gets more practice!

I have been a SAHM since my son was born. When he was 6 months old, I worked about 8 hours a week at Sylvan Learning Center. I worked one week day afternoon/evening (babysitter would come at 3, dad would relieve sitter at 5, then I would be home by 7). I also worked Saturday mornings (8-12). This gave my DH the opportunity for alone time with our son. He learned his schedule, gave baths, read books, ran errands, etc. I think he learned it better since I wasn't there to "help". I no longer work, but he still parents very independently!

If your friend's husband is not being very helpful, it sounds like he is either lazy, or he figures being a SAHM is a 24-7 job and therefore he doesn't need to help. If your friend and her husband can instead start looking at her job as a day job that ends when he gets home, it will help them start working as a team. I know this is way easier said than done.
By working together to take care of the house and kids in the evening, your friend's husband can learn how to be a better husband and competent dad.
I agree with your friend that it is not really safe to leave the kids alone with him at this point. Would you leave your children alone with an adult who pinches and hits them?
My sister swaps childcare with a friend a couple times a month. My sister watches her friend's kids for a few hours, and later on her friend watches my sister's kids. One of my work friends does this, too. It's good for the kids (playtime with other kids), especially good for the mom who's getting a few hours off, and easy on the pocketbook because there's no money involved. Does your friend have someone she could do this kind of exchange with? You, maybe?

It seems that dad needs to spend more time with the kids to get his groove. It may not be perfect, and it may not look like it does when mom is in charge but it still is their special time together. I humbly suggest that your friend gently empathize with her husband and maybe have a few laughs (this parenting gig is not always pretty). Then do it again, and again. She needs to have a life and the kids are not exclusively hers. With some support he needs to take responsibility for his kids and let his wife be a human and not just a mom for a while.

I don't ever recall leaving my children with my husband for the entire day the first time I left him alone with them. It was for a couple of hours and even that was too much for him! The thing is that men do not "get it" when it comes to what we SAHM's do. My husband has time and time and time again said to me, "I don't know how you do it, how you do it all!" Sometimes, to be honest, I don't either but I manage. Women were designed to be mothers, to be the ones to be the primary care takers for our children while men were designed to be the ones to go out in the wilderness and bring home the food...so the wives can cook it. : )

I agree with the lady who said to do this in baby steps. Leave the kiddos alone with hubby for an hour...long enough to run to the store or long enough for you to take a walk around the block, then gradually increase that time away. It's also very important, in my opinion, to leave your husband with some sort of "list" of things to do....sort of like a "to do" list. Lunch at this time, naps at this time and if you expect him to accomplish any task (wash dishes, a load of laundry, etc.) then list that as well. My husband says my lists are too long. LOL. I tell him it's what I would be doing if it were me home with the kiddos so I give him plenty of options to choose from, even if he doesn't check them all off the list. Sometimes we have to treat our husband's like we would if he were a hired babysitter...you need to fully explain what you expect from this time that you will be away and make it clear that if things get out of hand that it is HE that must take a time out so that he doesn't vent his frustrations on the children. Tell him how you handle chaos when it presents itself. And remember: men do things differently than we mom's do. Try your best not to criticize his "best" efforts.

Some men don't get it, she needs to politely and calmly speak with him about it, and share with him how she has found a good routine and techniques that work with the kids. Give him ideas of activities, snack times, good disciplines, calming techniques...

Does he not help parent on the weekends or during the evenings, or help his wife with cleaning, dishes, laundry, cooking? If not, he needs to start! I feel so lucky for my husband right now, who is very understanding and amazing with our kids, as well as helping me around the house!

Dr. Sears has a wonderful series of parenting and discipline advice for fathers, perhaps they she can print it out and they can read it together:
http://www.askdrsears.com/html/10/t110100.asp

leave the kids with the hubby again. While junk food is not a good thing, no one died or got sick and his frustration is the beginning of appreciating her. The more time the kids are left with him, the more organized he will be (ie., plan meals for both himself and them) and he will appreciate what she does even more.

I think he has to do small steps - you can't just throw him in for the whole day! Start with him doing lunch and naps with specific instructions. After a few times of that, then she can do dinner and bedtime (not from lunch on, but from when they are asleep at nap time on). BABY STEPS. She has had years of knowing what to do and gradually getting into it, he needs to be trained little by little.