The Debate... Are You Watching It?

Proverbs 29:9
"When a wise person debates with a fool, the fool rages and laughs, and there is no peace and quiet."

Ryan had facts. Biden had nothing but giggling and interruption.

Biden was a buffoon.

The winner? Martha!!

If Biden "doesn't" interrupt Ryan then Ryan keeps going! And Ryan is getting more talk time than Biden. Maybe it's not a popular opinion but I LIKE Bidens attitude. He knows what he's talking about.

Well there's an older gent beating the snot out of Eddy Munster on my television right now!
I think Eddy might cry!
So sad. Lol

ETA: I can admit that Obama was "off" in the first debate and I can see why Romney was declared the winner. Why can't Republicans admit when they've been thrashed, which was clearly the case tonight with the VPs?

Watching with my 17 yr old who just reminded me every vote counts and she turns 18 on 12/27 so she's bummed.

Her words ". Why does Biden continue to have the sarcastic laugh/smirk and as VP of this country is so disrespectful to not allow Ryan to finish a statement without interrupting? "Gees we show more respect than that as Seniors in high school when we debate and present ideas."

OMG

Yes, Biden has laughed at Paul Ryan the entire time.. and i cant blame him. He is laughable.

If Biden says "my friend" one more time I may throw something at the TV

I loved every minute of it. I loved Biden. He showed the outrage that us voters feel when listening to that tool Ryan lie and lie and lie, make things up and evade questions. Good for Joe! I mean honestly - how could one keep a straight face when hearing Ryan - of all people - talk about "bipartisanship"? He's the biggest partisan of them all!

And to those who are clueless, "my friend" is how congressional colleagues refer to each other when debating. Try watching C-span sometime to see how your government actually works (or, in the case of the gridlocked, partisan Congress, doesn't).

I hope Obama actually shows up at the next debate vs. being too cool and polite to interrupt as Romney makes stuff up. I wanted to throw something at the TV over half the BS Romney was spinning last week and there was Obama, politely waiting his turn. Good for Joe for showing some authentic outrage.

Yes and I hope all of America is watching it. Biden is a disrespectful idiot. He has giggled/chuckled/laughed the entire debate.

The liberal take is hysterical. Debates are not won on lies, they are won on facts. It is interesting what Biden let slip to America and if the undecided pick up on it Obama is screwed. They calculated that 2,000 tax increase on the middle class by cherry picking the three most popular deductions used by the middle class. Mortgage interest, child care, and college tuition.

A little background, I am an accountant, I studied tax, ordinary income is defined in one paragraph of the tax code. After that there are thousands of pages, the damn book is three inches thick, of deductions and exemptions!

Thousands!! and they pick those three and ignore thousands of other deductions that could be removed to make the Romney numbers add up just fine.

My favorite line, and he wants to take away the education credit that allows middle class families to afford to send their kids to college. University tuition runs from $18,000 to past $60,000 a year! Mr. Biden, do you really expect us to believe that a $1,000 exemption allows people to send their kids to college!!??

What the liberals are counting on is that people don't get that those big numbers they plug into Turbo Tax don't actually add up to real money back. They are hoping that people continue to not realize that cutting their tax rate by 5% saves them more than all their deductions combined!! Add to that if the standard deduction is allowed to stand the middle class will have a lower effective tax rate than what Romney is stating.

Tax code is icky, I get that, I hate it myself but they are banking on people not caring to continue to lie to you.

So far as the debate goes, Ryan actually did win. Sorry but you don't get points for snotty comments under your breath, laughter and interruptions and that was all that Biden brought to the game. I am for the most part disappointed, I was hoping it would at least be funny.

I love how conservative Romney fans call Biden "rude" or "disrespectful" but cheer on Romney for interrupting Obama last week during their debate. Same behavior, but coming from the Republicans, it's okay? Take it from a real Bay State resident, you do not want Romney in charge of the nation.

Yes.
Biden is TRYING to come off as the elder statesman to the young naive uninformed "youngster"... but he is only succeeding in looking rude, arrogant and disrespectful. He's even told the moderator she was wrong about something... and surprisingly, she has not done as terrible a job as I thought she would.

He is speaking like a person does when they are hard of hearing and are talking to someone who is not... slow "box-y" speech that is just a little too loud. It reflects poorly on him.

ETA: Sadly, it is like listening to my Dad get animated about something that he can only repeat himself about without considering what the other person is contributing to the conversation. My Dad will turn 71 in a few more months.... maybe it is the age?

ETA: Biden got almost 2 entire minutes more talk time than Ryan. Not to mention all the time of Ryan's that he rudely talked/joked or muttered/laughed over so that what Ryan was saying was hard to hear. Totally rude.

I wish Paul Ryan would be a little more assertive. However, Biden is doing a good job acting like a rude, disrespectful a$$. I have never liked Biden and this didn't change my feelings. If anything just made them stronger.

It wasn't so much the laughing that negated Ryan, but Biden's massive experience and clear facts in comparison. That little boy got spanked, even if Biden was giggling. I was giggling too. Interrupting? Not as much as Romney did, and thank God Biden corrected him when necessary.

I always think of Biden as a bit of a joke, but I was reminded of how long he's been doing this and how much he actually knows.....Ryan? Not so impressed. It's like he doesn't remember the Bush years and was trying to invent some Reagan stuff (until Joe cut him off and was "there" for the meeting Ryan was referencing from a school book..) but most of all I LOVE how Romney and Ryan keep trying to look pro-middle-class when it's so hilariously opposite of what they stand for.

Yup, and can't stand the lies coming out of Paul's mouth.

I am...don't like the smirk on Paul's face!

I saw way more of Biden's giant false teeth than I ever thought possible and why on earth does he keep saying "my friend"? He acted like a child with the smiles and laughter while Ryan was speaking. Even my 10 yr old noticed his rude behavior. There is no way in h-e-double hockey sticks I would want him as acting president! There is a grown up way to get one's point across when in disagreement with another and Biden failed miserably. Ryan held it together very well considering the idiotic distractions.

Surprisingly, it did change my mind a bit, and that has never happened before. Leaning more Republican, I was quite disappointed at what I saw in the debate and while I have some serious personal concerns with some peripheral issues, I do not want to support this ticket at all. I'm annoyed at the noise that's being made about "Ryan beating Biden" or the silly jokes being made now. I didn't see anything in the debate that I would consider funny or victorious. It has given me pause for concern more than anything else. Biden's laughing out of annoyance was not as upsetting to me as Ryan's bug-eyed smirking. (same idea and purpose there, isn't it?) I hate a smarmy grin. :(

When Biden was talking about Romney's "47%" and Ryan's "30%", the "whys" on the auto bailout, etc...Ryan's rebuttal against these actual issues was to tell a huggy kissy little story about Romney sitting in a fellow church member's living room and paying their kids' college tuition after a terrible car accident. That's a nice story, he's a nice guy. Guess what? THAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE TOPIC AT HAND!!!! And did anybody notice that he chose THAT story, of all the money that Romney has donated that could be talked about, he chose THAT story, when everyone knows that Biden's wife and daughter were killed in a car accident, the 2 boys critically injured and needing constant care for a long time? That was slimy to me. It was nothing but pure TACTIC to shake Biden up, and had nothing at all to do with bailing out the auto industry and what should have been done instead then, or the "welfare state" comments that were being discussed at that moment.

Why did Biden interrupt? Because the debate TACTIC that Ryan chose was the Carl Rove style of talking, where you spend the JOINT 4 minutes that you share roaming and tap dancing around with nice warm fuzzy stories naming peoples' names and spending a whole lot of time instead of hitting issues in bullet point style and getting your point across. I was on my school's debate team 20 years ago, and in my limited little experience there, I know that you CAN get your points across in an expedient fashion if you (a) have a point to make, (b) really feel a desire to get something said for people to think on, (c) have even the slightest concern that you may say something that someone can then rebut that you can then answer and defeat with. Ryan rambled and told little stories (was even warned several times by that lady "this is a 2 minute answer..." when he started talking like a friendly old grandpa sitting on the porch talking over a cup of tea). He once giggled and said to Biden "I understand you're feeling under duress but you need to stop interrupting" to which Biden answered "then stop taking up the whole 4 minutes!" (Even the giggle beforehand, the calling Biden out, and the smile and stammer afterwards were stall tactics). That drew our attention to it, and my husband and I actually started TIMING it afterwards and it was that way much of the debate.

One thing that did make us laugh out loud, because we didn't know about it before: after Ryan went on and on about how he's so whole-heartedly against the stimulus plan, Biden said "Well we're not allowed to bring letters here to the debate but you can go to the website to see them: you sent TWO letters ASKING me for money from the stimulus..." and Ryan was like "Well, yeah....that's what we do...". That WAS funny. We laughed along with Biden on that. Go figure. So yeah....I guess there was a couple funny moments in the debate after all.

For the rest, I thought this fact check article was helpful.
http://news.yahoo.com/fact-check-slips-vice-presidential-...

When someone is ill prepared and nervous, they often hide behind laughter and snickers. If we are really lucky, if America is really lucky, Biden will finally be given his "retirement notice" in just over three weeks.

I thought the entire debate was one of tit for tat. CNBC said Ryan won 59/33 with the rest undecided.

Biden just made me more willing to volunteer for the Romney campaign. I can't imagine what would happen to America under Biden if Obama was to die in office.

Good luck to America if Obama wins another 4 years to screw up America.

Haven't watched all of it, but from what I've seen so far, the following comes to mind: "If a wise man has an argument with a fool, the fool only rages and laughs, and there is no quiet." Proverbs 29:9

ETA: Haha, Cheryl O., Great minds, eh? ;-)

I think it's funny the only thing the repubs have to say about Biden is he was smug/disrespectful. Well, if that's all they got - that puts Biden in the winners circle. Romney/Ryan have always played the whining card -'he's hurt my feelings, he's rude, he needs to apologize to me' - instead of showing up with the facts and details as the dems do.

I was too distracted by Biden's mesmerizing, big, perfect white teeth to pay attention. I was hoping they would fall out so I could confirm that they were fake...

Biden was too disrespectful and a-holish for me to even continue to watch. Who wants that helping lead the country?

BTW @ LeeLee - when you have to smile, laugh and be utterly rude it could also mean you're insecure and unconfident....It works both ways...

.

When you've gotta talk about the teeth, the smiles, the laughs ... you LOST.

Veteran Joe cleaned that novice Ayn Rand wanna-be's clock.

And hearing Ryan talking about his plans for bipartisanship? Don't make me friggin' laugh. Actions speak louder than words and we've seen Ryan's actions. Believe me, he'll be stabbing Romney in the back just like he did Boehner over the debt deal negotiations.

Favorite moments:
1. Ryan Stimulus hypocrisy ... bags on it when he begged twice via letter for said stimulus bucks

2. Ryan telling America that his Catholic abortion views are best for America (REALLY???)

3. Biden telling America that Ryan voted to cut embassy security funding by half a billion dollars

4. Ryan criticizing toughest sanctions in history on Iran, backed by 49 US allies (making history) and Joe asking him "What do you want to do? Go to WAR with Iran??"

5. Biden telling America the truth about the Romney/Ryan budget ... IMPOSSIBLE to achieve what they are claiming without cutting mortgage deductions, health deductions, college deductions for middle class.

6. And finally, Biden looking right into the camera and reminding Americans that Republicans have wanted to dismantle the social safety net (social security and medicare) SINCE THEIR INCEPTION.

Better take another sip of water, Ryan.

Biden lost. He's a fool. Anyone who thinks otherwise is a fool.

How many comments have he and the big O made in reference to putting Conservatives in the back seat and not caring about the people who work for what they have? Jiminey crickets people! WAKE UP!! If you seriously think you are doing well under the Obama administration, I feel sorry for you. It's really entertaining to see the people who have a higer level of intelligence voting with Romney, and those who have a higher desire to screw the rest of us out of what we've worked for and bury our kids in debt votes for Obama.

The one thing I didn't like....
When the question was asked about military, etc.......

Ryan started talking about Obamacare and taxes.

I come from a military family. I have a son who wants to enlist. I am completely against it.

I wish Ryan would have actually answered the question.

Just my opinion.

If one of my kids were as disrespectful as Joe I would slap them. I am impressed that Ryan had patients with both Joe and the moderator. I would prefer a second in command that could conduct himself with dignity as he carries out his job. It also helps that Ryan knows what he is talking about.

well, it didn't change my mind, simply because i think romney is a complete horror show. but it was a very unpleasant surprise. i thought biden was just awful. i hoped he would refute the alarming lies and spin coming from the romney campaign, but i was really taken aback by the smarmy smirking, inappropriate toothy mocking laughter, and endless discourteous interruptions. while i don't think ryan did or said anything memorable at all, he won for me simply because he was somewhat respectful and acted like an adult.
i found this debate even more disconcerting than the presidential one.
:( khairete
S.

I enjoyed the debate. It's interesting that both Romney and Biden won by acting in very similar manners; yet, for Romney supporters, Biden was rude, while it was OK for Romney to interrupt and act smug.

There is a part of me that hopes the Republicans can run their full agenda one of these days. It would be great for people to actually see what their agenda entails. My hubby and I do well enough that we can remaining standing in an oligarchy to some extent, but so many republican supporters will lose their shirts if Ryan and Romney had their way.

I really don't' get how people can vote against their own interest, but this isn't about reasoned argument, it's about ideology and faith.

I typically do not like interrupting someone when speaking. I enjoy being an active listener, and I expect others to do the same. However, what Paul Ryan was counting on last night--and what Willard Romney counted on last week--was going on momentum. It seems to matter none what they're saying, as long as they are on a roll, which is what makes it sound authentic and believable. Interruptions break their stride and throw them off their script, forcing the real issues to come forward if for only a second. I was more than fine with last night's interruptions. The "good" that Willard does is always short-term--Boiler Room, if you will--and then he moves on. As much as I love Richard Gere's character in Pretty Woman, that guy is like Romney, just living for the takeover and making people think that it's all good just because it gets pretty really fast. Then, by the time they notice that their pockets are empty, he's in the wind, on to the next conquest. And they blame the new guy in charge, because the hammer actually came down on his watch. Never mind that the rope had been cut and the hammer was hanging by a very thin thread, when the draft from the culprit's swift departure started the hammer on its final swing.

That's Romney's history, and that does not last long term. I like that President Obama has not been too afraid to say, "Let's take our medicine and do our work." His goal is to set America up for long-term success, by undoing and redoing. It doesn't feel good at first, but the effects are longer and stronger. We seem to be satisfied with going from short-term solution to short-term solution. Nobody is interested in stopping the gigantic ship to Hell and resetting the course. I guess as long as we look good when we get there, it doesn't matter what the name of the place is. We'll probably just stick a flag in it, anyway, and give it a new name. "'HELL' no more. We christen thee 'AMERICA 2.0'."

I thought Biden was terribly rude. I taught elementary school children that didn't yell, laugh or interrupt another person's ideas the way Biden did, and if they did, they were reprimanded for it. The moderator should have called him out on that. Of course, Biden had every right to challenge Paul Ryan, that is the essence of a debate! But talking for his allotted time and then heckling Paul Ryan by smirking, laughing and mumbling under his breath during Ryan's allotted time was nothing more than bullying. How am I, the viewer, supposed to make an informed decision when one of the candidates keeps talking over the other one? What makes Biden think that I won't listen to what Ryan says and weigh it against what Biden says and possibly change my vote. Makes you wonder why he deliberately kept trying to interrupt Ryan's thought process. Very distracting and annoying!
I just love how people keep justifying Biden's actions because he was catching Ryan in a "web of lies". Umm..ya sure you want to call that pot black there, kettle? Jay Carney was all over clarifications on Friday morning for all the inaccurate statements Biden made about the Benghazi attack, Catholic Bishops released a statement about the whole "being on board' with the Obamacare fertility piece not being true and AARP also released a statement that they are a non-partisan organization and do not endorse either candidate or their policies (in regards to Obamacare or Medicare)Even Sesame Workshop released a statement for the Obama camp to not use Big Bird in one of their attack ads. I'm not saying Ryan didn't spin the truth either because all politicians, parties and media do it, but let's call a spade a spade, shall we? I also don't get how people can even suggest Romney's behavior was any way similar to Biden's. Romney challenged Obama, but he never smirked,heckled or talked over him during Obama's allotted time to speak. In fact, I believe they recorded that Romney talked less minutes than Obama did during the whole debate!
The fact that Obama encouraged Biden's behavior attests to his poor character as well. He knew Romney killed it in his own debate, so he unleashed Crazy Uncle Joe to bully his opponent for him. Bullying among our young people is at an all time high and here we have the leaders of the free world promoting it and encouraging it on live television. I thought Paul Ryan handled himself with class and dignity and held his own quite well considering how young he is in comparison to Biden's experience as a politician. Character counts and I think it will show in the polls on November 6.
By the way, I completely agree with your SWH. It is why Romney/Ryan have my vote this year. I used to be a Democrat. I loved the Clintons. I also voted for Gore and Kerrey because I did not like Bush. I thought he was a war monger, and very much part of the reason for our financial woes, and as a former teacher I thought NCLB was extremely flawed. I could not vote for McCain because I thought he would be more of the same, but could not bring myself to vote for Obama. There was something about him that rubbed me the wrong way, so I wrote in my vote. Essentially throwing my vote away, but it was the only way I could participate in the 2008 election process. Now I see THIS election as one of the most important of our lifetime. I think Romney and Ryan are sincere and highly intelligent. I know they won't throw our country under the bus. Not so sure about the other choice. I have looked to the Bible as the best fact checker when forming my decision and then watch the candidates to see how well they align to that.
Obama said, Egypt is neither friend or foe. Matthew 12:30 has an answer to that. In regards to redistribution of wealth, check out Genesis 47 to see how that worked out for Pharaoh and his people until God stepped in. And Zechariah 12 holds a stern warning for anyone that rebuffs God's chosen land, Israel and its people. Leviticus and Timothy also warn against the topics of overspending and excessive government. And lastly, in light of the debate the other night Proverbs 29:9 has been all over Facebook, Twitter and other media outlets "If a wise man argues with a fool, the fool only rages and laughs."
A.

didn't watch it.

I don't care what either of them have to say. Change will only happen when the senate and the house are started all over again with a clean state. That's where the true power lies, not in some glorified figure head...like the presidency.

I'm not saying the president isn't important, only that his power is only as great as those in the house and the senate. Right now, both houses need a good cleansing.

Yes and it's horrifying . . . I can't believe either one of these guys would be one heartbeat from the presidency.

Yikes.

Biden did not bother me in the same way you describe as I think much of what Ryan said was laughable. Ryan didn't bother me either. I think he did the best job he could have possibly done. But I thought Biden did a good job of showcasing that Romney's tax plan will simply not work and is mathematically impossible (and it is... if you really think your taxes will be lowered at the same time we raise our defense spending, your seriously misinformed). I also think the best part of the debate was when Ryan tried to call out Biden about his opening his mouth a little too much and saying some insensitive/ untimely things which Biden can be know to do from time to time. But Biden's comeback was absolutely RIGHT ON... he said "I always say what I mean, and so does Romney." I don't trust Romney and Ryan further than I can spit. I think he, and you perhaps, are out of touch with reality. I am self employed and my husband and I own and run 2 other small businesses. I am an educated hard working person who will NOT be voting for Romney... And... if we want to look at this historically, Obama should NOT be voted in for a second term due to the state of our economy, yet I find it amazing that he continues to edge out the opponant (depending on which slanted media is viewed). So this says that there are a lot of people who have bought into the "it takes time to get out of the mess he started with", or it says a lot about how weak of a contender Romney is. Either way, I suspect we will go on as usual. Politician's will continue to lie to us and protect their own self interests and the corporations that buy them, and the media will continue to do their best to divide our country! (and for the record, I have not read any of these responses other than your "so what happened?")

I agree with Kristina. Joe Biden is acting too animated also. I do however think he has picked up the pace along the way.