Seeking Marriage Advice

Well in his words I know what I need to do but just don't want to! WOW that is a big answer to me. If he wanted to make things work he would try for at least a little while.
He won't try so you have to decide what you want. Talk to the kids to don't spring this on them they know something isn't right already. Good Luck,

I think Ericka has some absolutely wonderful advice. Wedding vows are promises and promises should never be broken unless all options have been exhausted. Both parties need to take responsibility for how they have reached the point they are in. I would absolutely read Ericka's advice many times over, go to counseling by yourself, with the attitude that you are going to fix your marriage, not that you will work out how justify a divorce. You are setting an example for your children on how to work through problems that exist. I like the idea of not even thinking divorce, not saying divorce and just acting that no such thing exists. You say yourself that you are emotionally checked out and that is on you, you cannot make him feel differently about you but you need to check back in because it's your marriage, if you are checked in then you have a better chance of getting him to check in as well. I'm not saying that he doesnt have work that he needs to do as well but like I said you cannot force him to do anything.. thats all you can do is fix your end. Good luck, I hope you make it work, you, your children and your family is worth it.

M.,

You may take my advice or leave it - with that said - you need to start dating you husband again. Don't think about dating someone else. Marriage is a COMMITMENT. It isn't an option that you can just throw away when you've satisfied a particular need. You are at the six year mark. That isn't an easy time. Come to think of it, NO TIME in marriage is EASY! Marriage is work and it takes two to make it work. You want a bunch of people to tell you that you need to go after what YOU WANT. But the fact is, you need to think about your husband and what he wants, your children and what they want. Life isn't about making yourself feel good, it's all about what you can do to make others feel good. It's really about service. Based on what you said, you are only focused on you and your mother and sister are your "YES" men. Take a step back, refocus, and take a good look at the man you married. Why did you marry him in the first place? Has he changed? Obviously you have - that is growth. Your marriage needs to be tended like a plant so that it too may grow. I think your husband is jealous of the new you and doesn't know how to deal with it. Give him a little love and attention, and he too will grow - you can help him grow into the man you once loved.

Lisa - married for 16 years

First of all, I would like to say that all advice is subject to the views and experiences of the individual, and without sitting and talking with you for hours to gain all the relevant details, firm advice is difficult to give. However, that being said, I will try to share a little, and I will pray very hard for you!

Four years ago my husband and I had hit rock bottom. I was the opposite of you; before, I had been confident, sure of myself, and sure of what I wanted. My faith in God was strong, my family loved me, and while I had always been the odd kid on the block it never bothered me. Then I got married, and after a year everything had changed.

My husband and I are complete opposites; he is left brained, I am right. He seeks fulfillment in a job well done, and while I am not afraid of work, I have no problem sitting down and doing nothing but write stories (I am an author) or draw/paint (I am also an illustrator). He is a clean freak. I don't like dirt, but I don't mind a little clutter. He is naturally, painfully blunt. I like to choose my words carefully, and word it in a non-painful way. (This last part was the klinker.) His bluntness, about everything: what I did, what I didn't do, whether I had showered that day or not, etc, began to wear on me. Words can be so cruel.

After the first year, I hated what I saw in the mirror. I thought I was ugly; I had a hard time sleeping. I gained weight. I thought that no matter what I did, I was not good enough. Our love life suffered. I didn't want to go home at the end of the work day. After a year and a half I wanted nothing more than to run as far as I could. The kicker? I still loved him, more than anything. That's what made the whole situation hurt so much. Still, I had reached the point of considering divorce. I had talked to him, my dad had talked to him, others had talked to him. Being so practical, though, he had a hard time understanding a 'non-linear thinking person', and therefore didn't see why he was in the wrong. He refused to go to counseling.

Finally I moved back in with my parents. This is what finally opened his eyes; suddenly I was gone, and he realized he was just a hairs breadth away from really, truly losing me.

Counseling worked for us; but only because he had suddenly been forced to face an ultimatum. I never SAID to him "Work this out with me or I'm leaving you for good." He recognized it on his own because I left. He recognized that he wanted to work things out, that things needed to be worked out, because he suddenly had a full week of me gone. I wasn't there when he got home, I wasn't there when he went to bed, and I didn't answer his calls or call him.

It is now four years later, and I can tell you today that there is no man I would rather be married to. I love him more than life itself, he thinks I'm the sexiest woman he's ever met, and we have a beautiful one-year old son. We learned to take our differences and use them to compliment the other.

One more thing: When the trouble was going on, there was an old high school sweetheart calling me and talking to me for hours; he wanted a second chance. So about that guy asking you out for drinks: RUN, as far and as fast as you can, away from it. You're married. Which makes him a man who has very low morals and character. You also do not need another man clouding up the picture. Trust me, it makes things much, much harder, for you, your husband, and for your kids, who are probably confused and worried enough already.

All of this being said, divorce should always be the absolute last resort, because it is hurtful, harmful, and as disastrous as a hurricane to everyone involved. Sometimes it is the better alternative; but you should approach it like a landmine.

If your husband says that he knows what to do, or has started making excuses not to go to counseling, it could be because, as a man, he does not want to admit that he is wrong and hurting his wife. I am not being sexist here, but women will do almost anything to make their man happy. Men, likewise, are naturally the protectors and providers, and take great pride in being the best man out there. This includes in the eyes of his wife. If he is suddenly feeling that you do not need him, or respect him, HE–WILL–ACT–OUT. Unfortunately, when men feel threatened, they usually act out the wrong way.

Men need respect the way women need to feel cherished and loved. It is a two way street, and at some point, someone needs to bite the bullet and say "Even though I am not getting what I need, I am going to give them what they need." You would be amazed how well this works. If my husband comes home snarling like a beast and makes me feel like his prey, I sit on his knee, and start to softly kiss his face, the entire time telling him what a hard worker he is, what a wonderful father he is, how much it means to me that he works so hard to provide for me, how handsome I find him, etc. It always, ALWAYS works. Within five minutes he is smiling and blushing, and then he can share with me whatever trouble he had encountered at work that had bothered him so much; but his mood has gone from night to day, all because he has been reassured that his wife still loves and respects him, and still finds him attractive. Whatever has happened, he is still the most important man in his wife's eye.

Likewise, my husband has learned that if I am not doing the above, more than likely it's because I need some TLC. He will alternately, throughout the day, hug me, kiss me, rub my shoulders, tell me how beautiful I am and how much he loves me, and presto! Suddenly his scowling scullery maid has transformed into his smiling princess!

What I am seeing here, in your case, is two people who still love each other, but have somehow fallen out of step. You have changed, for the better, but yet you have changed. You have become independent, confident. You are no longer the sad and needy woman you were. So how do you relate to your husband? How do you show him, reassure him, that he is still the man in your life, the man you respect, love, and adore? That even though you are independent, you still need him? Likewise, how will he learn to relate to the new you? How will he show this new, confident, independent woman that he loves her and cherishes her?

I don't know if he needs an ultimatum, like my husband did, to finally get his head in the game and start working towards fixing your relationship. But I do believe that if/when you do work it out, your marriage will be better than it ever has been. You still love each other. The dynamics have changed, and you need to relearn how to communicate and relate.

I realize this was a very, very long response. I hope and pray that this helps, and I will pray that you and your husband grow together again!

God bless!
M.

Get the movie " fireproof" and watch it with him - it's very inspiring about reviving a troubled marriage and just might inspire him to get off his butt and work on your marriage and love you the way he should! It was very inspiring to both me and my husband and I think you'd both get a lot out of it.

You've already decided to end your marriage. Your ability to write this is sign enough. Having been through two divorces, one involving outside affairs, please take care of this marriage/divorce before starting a new relationship. Your negotiations with your current husband will be much easier, your view of yourself, and other's view of your actions will be much more positive. You have lots of time to start a new relationship after things are settled into your new life.

Please consider mediation instead of two separate and very expensive lawyers. We used Erickson Mediation in Bloomington (http://www.ericksonmediation.com/). This didn't just save us money, but allowed us more flexibility in making decisions jointly about our daughter and kept the conflict and anger to a minimum. Lawyers make more money the more conflict they can create. Starting an emergency fund is a good idea, but I wouldn't keep it secret, all money needs to be part of the negotiation, and if it comes out that you aren't being honest with money, you will be putting your negotiations at risk.

Good luck to you, and keep taking care of yourself physically and emotionally through this process, so that you have the energy needed to give your children the emotional support they will need.

As for the responders that say you need to MAKE this marriage work (when your husband says he doesn't want to). I worked way too hard for 20 years to "make" my marriage work. It does "take two", and unless he will commit, you can work your butt off and you will only wear yourself down, show your kids a unhealthy example of a relationship, and regret not taking charge and living a happy life.

Hello M.,

It seems like you got some really good advice and things to think about. Two of the ladies mentioned the movie "Fireproof". It is a great movie. The only thing I want to add to this is to read the book "The Love Dare" which is mentioned in the movie and is like a workbook where you have 40 days of "assignments" which if you follow through and do should help your marriage. I am also struggling in my marriage and I bought the book with the plan to diligently follow all 40 days and unfortuanly I only got about 10 days into it and then kind of gave up when it got harder to do the things I needed to do. Both my husband and I are going through counseling together. I am the one that has kind of "checked out" on the marriage and struggle putting forth the effort. I know what needs to be done but sometimes it is hard to do it. I know in my heart what I need to do but then the stress of work and kids gets in the way and unfortunately my husband and our marriage often takes third or forth place in my life. But I know that giving up and getting a divorce won't make things any better. We both love each other but have admitted that we are not "in love" with each other and he has admitted that sometimes he doesn't even like me. I am just thankful that he is putting up with me and giving me time to start making more of an effort. A marriage does take two but if I were you I would follow the advice of the others and continue to go to counseling alone and find your own happiness within your marriage. If he sees that you are happy maybe that will motivate him more to strive to be happy as well. I would kind of tell him "I am not going to leave this marriage. I am going to choose to be happy and when you finally decide to make an effort and come back to counseling just know that I will be here waiting." Good Luck and God Bless!

M.,
I totally understand changing and growing ahead of your spouse. I did the same thing and gained huge confidence and took my 3 year old son and left my husband 5 years ago. College educated etc etc. I lost all my stability. And going back into the dating process, my confidence waivered, and I kind of allowed things to spin out of control- even with the help of my family. Try to keep you mom and sister out of it. That is what I allowed to happen to my marriage- I still love that man to death, and now think staying would have been the best thing for my son, but I am 5 years too late.

from what i read-you already made up your mind and just looking for validation.do what you gotta do to make yourself happy-cuz no one else will.sounds like hubby is just as unhappy-or having an affair.maybe ive been single way to long-but i just dont understand why you wives take on all this mess for so long-and let these men treat you like dirt-its so frustrating-after less than a yr of it from my hubby-i was done-i had 2 babies-workin 2 jobs and started school-ive been divorced from him 27 yrs now-never once looked back with regrets.weve gone thru some real tough times-i was 23 when i divorced-kids an i were both much happier after the fact.it was a tough road-made alot of sacrifices-but it was worth it-my kids an i have an untouchable relationship.i had no family support at all.still dont.my sons house burnt down thxgiving nite-he got out safe-lost everything-not one family member stepped up to help-nor did his dad.im constantly on the search for donations-and doing what i can.its been a rough month to say the least.you need to decide where you want your life to go.good luck.

I would try everything you can not to jump to the divorce conclusion. I have a friend who was in almost your exact situation (right down to being the sole breadwinner). She got divorced 2 years ago and has been in a depression ever since. It's not easier to divorce, even though it seems that way before you head into it. Love is not a feeling, it's a decision. Decide to love your husband for a while and see if that makes any difference. Write him a letter to tell him how you appreciate that he works hard and how hard it must be on him to leave his family all week long. Put love notes in his suitcase. Give him a backrub while he's watching TV. Even if he doesn't respond right away, keep thinking of ways to woo him. If you try this for 2 months and can really say you gave it your all and he didn't respond, then you can honestly say you tried for yourself and for your kids. PS. Try and leave other people out of your marriage - it's between you and him.

I would recommend reading the book The Case for Marriage. It references a study that follows up with people 5 years after a divorce and finds they are no happier. In fact the people who have stayed married are more satisfied with their marriages 5 years down the road. You can still go to marriage counseling yourself even if you husband doesn't. I found out that even one person going to counseling can make a difference. I wish I had know about this before now. Believe me I know it is difficult, but worth the effort. My husband and I are going to start marriage counseling this week after I've begged for it the last 3 years. When there are kids involved you will always be dealing with your husband whether you are married eor not. You'll have less control of what is happening with them when they would be with their father. Being the child of divorced parents, I always hated it. Also definitely break the contact off with the co-worker. You need to put a hedge around your marriage. Please please don't give up.

My sign came from when I was glad to see him afterwork to staying at work late to avoid him at home. No it isn't easy and I too was the main wage earner, however my child wasn't his blood so that part was easier. You are lucky you have family support. I did it alone.

Good luck you deserve to be happy as does your childern. It was much better on my daughter after.

If you are happiest when he is not there and he doesn't want to do what it takes to make you happy - just sign the papers and let him find an apartment close to his job. Yes it will be tough on the kids, but they need to have a good functional marriage for their example and your spouse isn't towing the line.

It sounds to me like he is the one who is lazy and depressed.

HI M.. I dont often respond to these for others, as I am much in the same boat so try to learn rather than teach! However, I have been learning a great deal about addressing the lazy-husband syndrome and want to share some of it with you. (see my post history for the long of it – scary similar)

The short of it: there is not a tell all sign and yes, an exit strategy is important. You know when you have had enough, and that is different for all of us. Its okay to fall out of love and its not your fault that your marriage is failing. Its not necessarily his fault either. We are dynamic beings and we change with time. I have found that the trickiest part of marriage is changing together in time. Some people do it, others just dont. Some people tolerate the differences over time, others not so much.

The biggest sign for me is still flashing, not sure how to interpret it - but the bases is that i still want to love my husband, even though i really dont anymore - i want to. If there is any piece of you that still wishes it just worked, or still wants to be in love with him, then dont throw in the towel yet. If you dont want to try to love him, even as he is today, you may be just passing time. It will take work on his part to make changes that you desire in him, and you dont have to settle to try to love him if he isnt trying to change - it might not work. I have been trying this. Like i said, this is the greatest sign i have had - realizing that i do still want it to work even with a very unhappy past few years much described like your story here. The next issue is determining when to finally give up. Maybe that is the point you are at. I would recommend continuing in therapy without him - and not dating anyone else until you have some clarity in the direction you are going and are legally separated (it could cost you big time in the divorce process). The therapist can give you independent advice, even about divorce logistics. Maybe your husband would benefit from going alone too.

Good luck and remember that if you divorce, your husband will always be in your life. Be nice and tell him to be nice too! Maybe a separation would do wonders for your relationship. Providing clarity for divorce, or helping re-ignite the drive in your husband to be more supportive if that’s what you hope to have happen. The greatest sign would be your feelings of whether you want to continue to try. If so, dont give up yet. I hope this helps!

Good luck! I'm sure your advice will go much smoother than mine is since you are the main source of income. In my situation I'm a stay at home mom, and in the last couple of months since my husband left he has racked up more bills, and lost his lisence.

I was married for 15.5 yrs when I finally left. It was the best thing I've ever done...for myself and for my kids! Before filing for divorce or anything like that, take a "Children in the Middle" class or something like it. It is for divorcing parents on what to expect from their kids and how to help them handle it. It's required in Iowa, not sure about where you are but it was a class that helped me help my kids in ways I never would have though of. Kids are resilient, much more than we give them credit for but they will also need a strong guiding hand to help them get through and learn how to cope. The more skills you have, the better you are and the better your kids will be. We would not have survived as well as we have were it not for that class! Your kids will grieve, that is normal and natural. The class will tell you what to look for so that you will recognize when and how your kids are grieving and how to help them get through it in the best way possible.

The fact that you are already considering going out with someone else tells me that you are already looking towards a new future, one that doesn't include your husband. If you are not happy and he is not trying then things will only get worse and worse between you and that is NOT good for the kids to see or live around. For those who say that you need a reason...what better 'reason' could there be than your own happiness and that of your children? It does you and them no good to have the example of "you made your bed now lie in it" because as I've found...you can always change the sheets or get a new bed before you lie in it. Just gotta clean up the old one first. Misery loves company but that doesn't mean we have to live in it or force others (children) to live in it either. Talk to your husband, present a united front to the kids (if possible) and keep your priorities on the straight and narrow....meaning fighting with dad is pointless and your kids are always first in all things....keep to that and all will end well for all of you. Good luck hun, you've got a long hard road ahead of you but with the right skills and mindset along with lots of hard work, it will be a road with rich rewards at the end.

M., don't know what to advise you, other than that I'min your boat, too.

I'll be thinking good thoughts for you. Hope the new year brings some good changes, right?

Good luck, you are not alone. Read my post request to mamasource from Dec 25.

I agree with what another person said...rent the movie "Fireproof" and watch it together. It can be a bit preachy & at the beginning the acting leaves something to be desired. But keep watching and you will be pulled into it. Keep a full box of tissues handy & be ready to experience every emotion while watching it. Make sure the kids are in bed & you have uninterrupted time to watch.

Don't give up yet. You obviously thought he was worth marrying to begin with & that deserves every effort to fight for your marriage. Good luck!

I think you've already made your decission and have a plan. You are just looking for others to tell you, besides friends, family, to tell you that you are right in your decission. Well I can't tell you that... neither can any of these women. Some sure will tell you divorce is never the answer, some will tell you to run.

The reason that I think you should just divorce is that is sounds like to me, and I do realize there are two sides to every story, you both are done and have given up. When there is a will there is a way I firmly believe in that but when BOTH parties are done and have checked out how is there hope? How can there be hope. I just believe there can't be.

Me and my husband of 11 years have had our tough times. We've talked about divorce three times during hard times. The reason why it never happened was because one of us still had hope and wanted to work it out. Deep down I think everytime we both did and just one of us was giving a cry for help, a cry to be noticed! Well we worked it out... we've had our ups and down but there was ALWAYS hope!

If you feel you have no hope and you see that your husband has none it's better for both of you... and I feel the children for you to part ways and for both of you to find happiness! If you feel there is hope though I think you should try and work this out till there is no hope anymore. You know what you need to do though more than often and stop looking from support from people who don't know your situation, you or your husband. . . because honestly all they can give you is their beliefs which isn't terrible helpful. Best of luck to you with whatever you decide. :)