Please Help. My Friend's Child Is Unbearable and I Don't Want to Be Around Her

Well, I would suggest more adult time and just get together without the kids if possible. Go out for coffee, a mani-pedi...whatever.

I would not subject my daughter with hers period... If it has truly gotten physical like you indicated, then you have to simply tell her that you both cannot be around her child if she continues to act like that. She might be offended, but really what else can you do? She has to know that her daughter is out of control and acts badly right?

It is possible the child has a hormone swing issue. Hypoglycemia or early diabetes can cause angry fits because adrenaline is kicked in when blood sugar drops. She gave a hint with that sugar thing she said...so she is well aware of it..... they will be more emotional than they should be for the situation, they will cry easily, they will just be over the top. yeah, 12 yrs old is when all the hornones kick in, and if there are any medical problems that cause blood sugar deregulation, it could be the culprit. Or she could just be a brat.....but... we started juicing fresh apple and carrot for my daughter and eating more raw foods and her hypoglycemia got much better.

Go forward gently...

"You know, I'd love to go with you, and I have also seen that Sally and Sarah just aren't getting along with each other right now. I think the girls need to take a break from each other, but if you are ever able to get a sitter, I'd love for just the two of us to go...."

If that is an option, that is what I would offer. This way doesn't place blame and I'd just work to keep the conversation as neutral as possible unless your friend opens it up further or asks for specifics. If she already knows what is driving your decision to create some space between the kids, being graceful enough to allow her to 'read between the lines' and not whack her over the head with it might be appreciated. You could also suggest some evening meet-ups (just for the ladies, no kids) for coffee or a drink instead. Since you have already talked to the parents, I think just politely keeping it to 'we're taking a break' is fine. I think Tiffany's answer covered the other bases I would have touched on, in regard to emotional investment/etc.

And as some others have said, I would only offer up counseling as an option if the other mom were asking/complaining directly to me, and then it would be "have you considered having your daughter see a counselor? It sounds like she's really unhappy"... and go from there.

i disagree with the suggestions to tell your friend to get her daughter a counselor. that's way overstepping the bounds of friendship UNLESS she asks for your advice.
but i would be very very firm with the boundaries when this little minx is in my house, and i'd be direct with both her and her mom about how to handle it. 'sugar is no excuse. this is unacceptable. i'm calling your mother to come pick you up. you may not behave this way in my home.'
'zelda, zafaria is being aggressive and disrespectful, i'm afraid. i need you come get her now.'
you're not 'hurting' her. you're giving her sensible and logical consequences to her actions around you and yours. it's not for you to fix her, nor to make her feel as if everything's okay. if you've corrected her and talked to her parents, it's time for you to let them cope as they see fit, and just take care of yourselves.
it's so hard when it's a good friend. i had to take a few years of mom-time only (which was rare as we we were both homeschooling and had kids in our back pockets all the time) or very limited time if the kids were all there. it wasn't even aggression toward my kids, it was just a super-bratty disrespectful attitude that i found galling. fortunately it was a phase, albeit a long one, so now i can once again enjoy my friend and her kids.
i'm glad you're telling her today that you're not going to subject yourself and your daughter to the 'tude any longer.
good luck!
khairete
S.

Oh Heck no!

When kids are in my home or with me out and about, they know the rules, because I make it clear , I do not put up with whining, tantrums and begging.

"We use our manners. We use our words and we respect each other."

And If a child cannot keep it together, they have a choice. A quiet time for a few minutes, or I will call their parents to come and pick them up.

Same for my child. If she behaved poorly while a guest was over, she would have to tell her visitor goodbye and apologize that she was going to be in time out. This never had to happen because she knew, I do not threat, I promise, I will follow through.

This girl being rejected is not your problem. It is her problem and her parents problem.

You need to protect your daughter and you do not deserve to be so stressed out by someones child.

You need to find the words to tell your friend, you are sorry, but you are just not used to the type of behavior you are experiencing with her child.

Tell her you are concerned about her child. You are concerned about your friend, how on earth does she get through each day? I have found that being sympathetic but honest, is the only way to handle these things and then I am willing to let the chips fall where they may.

If this means in the future you only go out with your friend and no children, then that is the way it needs to be .

I have a VERY dear sweet friend that has a daughter that has some issues. We are all so close I am even friends with the Grandparents.
For years we tried to make things work. Once our daughters were in college, My daughter told me, "I am sorry, but I will not be able to be around her any more."

Having to tell my friend and even the grandparents was difficult. I started the conversation and then our daughter handled it very graciously and apologetically, but she was honest. They know this is a problem for this girl. They were not surprised.
Our daughter was so relieved, and so was I.

Tip toeing around this is not doing them any favors.

Take mom for a drink, alone to do this. Give her a hug and tell her you can tell this is wearing on her. And then let her respond. Remember this is not YOUR fault.

I agree with those who went with this tactic:
You know, our girls just don't seem to get along. This is a tough age, so I'm sure they'll outgrow it. But for now, let's schedule a girls' night out so we can get together without the kids a few times and give them a break from each other.

And then plan your trip to the event in 2 weeks without mentioning it to her. If she brings it up, tell her that you decided that this is a great chance for your and your daughter to have some one-on-one bonding.

We had friends with a little girl right around the same age as my stepdaughter. After the last visit to their house my stepdaughter asked us very politely if we had to ever go back. She paused after asking and basically said the other little girl was too much. We were hardly surprised and we honored her request. We told her we understood the visits weren't fun anymore so we'd put off the visits for a while. We noticed our friends' little girl was overbearing and dominating, stressing ours out. No matter what we said or did the girls just weren't a good mix which is what we told our friends. "Jane and Bob, sorry but right now our girls aren't getting along so we're going to take a break. We want them to have a good time but it's not working out that way." They took it well and we haven't been back since. Believe me when I say this kid was walking birth control. She was enough to drive you crazy within five minutes because her parents enforced zero boundaries with her. At the end of the day it was not worth it. It wasn't my kid or my problem when theirs acted like a wild animal. My problem was my kid who was not having a good time and who was simulatneoulsy feeling bullied and overwhelmed. My job was to help mine navigate the waters and when it just didn't smooth out, we got her out of the situation and kept it her away. Life’s too short to put up with things like this in my opinion. Good luck.

How we feel about events in our lives do not come from the event, they come from what we think about the event. Our thoughts create our feelings. Therefore, you cannot make someone else feel anything. Only their thoughts can make them feel any particular feeling. If this young girl or her mother feel rejected that is their responsibility, not yours and your daughter.

Worrying about how other people will feel is a major hindrance to us creating healthy boundaries. It is unhealthy to give up your boundaries by taking responsibility for someone else. Respect yourself and your daughter enough to be responsible for yourselves and your boundaries. Respect the other mother and daughter enough to believe that they can resolve their own issues.

The ten year old girl needs good individual and family therapy. You cannot provide that for her. You cannot make this better for her. You can care enough to say that you are unwilling to tolerate harmful behavior in you life and your daughter can do the same. This does not mean you shame the other girl. It simply means that you model that certain behaviors cause certain consequences. She cannot learn if everyone simply tolerates her behavior because they think that is being nice. It is kind to gently let her know that you will no longer allow that behavior in your space. It is kind to gently communicate with her mother what your new boundaries are. It is kind for you and your daughter to have a safe, loving environment.

There is a difference between fixing and supporting. You can support the mom in solutions. You can listen. You can share information. You can communicate openly, clearly, and directly with kindness and honesty.
Fixing is getting attached to their outcome. Fixing is taking responsibility for that outcome. Fixing is getting overly involved and sends a message that the other person isn't capable of healing their own stuff.

This mom and daughter need lots of support right now. They definitely need professional support. It is their choice to heal this or not. It is your choice to create and hold healthy boundaries.

This is a great place for you to teach your own daughter how to have boundaries and release the "nice girl syndrome" and learn kindness instead. The "nice girl syndrome" is all about taking responsibility for others, not speaking your truth, giving yourself away, etc. all in the name of being nice. Kindness is about respect, speaking your truth, having boundaries, gentleness, and self-care.

I'd sit down with the mom and visit about this. Tell her your daughter is not wanting to go with them because of the physical violence. Listen to your friends explanation. Is she confused and worried about her daughter? Not really knowing what to do at this point? OR is she making excuses? This is just how my daughter is....

Once your find out what her thoughts are you may have much more insight. If she is tired of fighting with the girl and has given up she might like having someone step in and help. On the other hand if she thinks her daughter is just find then you have to sever ties with her kids.

I had a best friend whose son drove me crazy. BUT she'd allow it, it was just him being himself. We both felt it took a village and we both had free reign to discipline the kids when we saw them doing something wrong. She was much more permissive than I am. Okay....I thought about it and decided that sometimes I was too strict and prohibited fun from happening. So I tried to allow more as long as no one was getting hurt.

I got so tired of him doing things that I didn't approve of in any way that I had to stop spending time with her when the kids were present. We'd gone on many road trips with the 4 kids and had a lot of fun but once the kids were older they just didn't mesh well anymore so we ended our long friendship.

I have had so much less stress without this kid in my life. I also learned I can be more flexible but when the line is crossed I could not be around that.

If you've already talked to the parents about this, then I see the next step as just following up with your actions. Take your daughter to this event when it's convenient for you, and don't invite the other group along. If the mother mentions it, leave it open with, "Let's see how we're feeling that day." Since you already plan to attend multiple times, you've got a little room to attend on your own without it being so in-your-face to them. Go alone first, and then go with the others later. "We wanted to check it out--enjoy it--on our own first, when we could give it our full attention."

Well, it sounds like she's been rejected because she is miserable to be around! Nobody else wants to be subject to her tantrums, either. If she is not your daughter's friend, then you are just being a babysitter for the friend. I would stop the frequent visits.

I would lay it out with her and her parents. If you invite her over, make it a specified duration, and if she acts up, she immediately goes home. She wants to blame sugar? "The bottom line is you are out of line and you cannot stay here. I'm calling your parents to pick you up." Don't worry about sheltering her or cutting her parents' down time short. If a child was physically attacking my child, she would not be back, honestly. I get that you feel sorry for her, but I also feel sorry for you and your daughter. There families where we are friends with the parents but not the kids, or we like the kids, but wouldn't invite their parents to a barbecue. If your kids aren't friends, be honest about it. Do something with your friend without the kids.

If you've already talked to the parents and nothing has changed, then you need to step back. You need to be firm, direct and upfront. Not "I think Suzy has had a bad day" but "Suzy had a tantrum and would not listen to me and hit my daughter. I cannot have this behavior in my home and Suzy cannot come over unless she can learn to be a good guest."

If their daughter has problems with lashing out at people in general, she's going to have problems socially and her parents need to address it. She may need therapy to address whatever she has going on.

If your friend is going to meet you at the event, you can go your own way if the kid acts up. "I think it's time for us to go to a different part of this event. We do not want to be a part of Suzy's tantrum."

She's really too old to be acting so childish. I'm sure the reason she's not making connections with children at school is because of this type of behavior. At this point you've already spoken with her and her parents and nothing has changed. You can give it one last shot being 100% honest by saying "Look it's not fun to be around your daughter when she behaves like a 4 yr old. If her behavior continues to be abusive toward my daughter then we'll have to get together without the children from now on." Your friend may or may not like it but your daughter is your first priority.

My best friend's kids were violent with pushing, shoving, biting, kicking, etc. She'd say "Boys will be boys" and not do a thing. Finally I had enough and we were just busy every time she invited us over. School work, school projects, etc. I'd see her for coffee or some shopping without the kids but they never play together anymore and only saw each other at parties a couple times a year.

10 yrs old is way too old for tantrums.
You might lose a friend (what sort of a friend uses you like this?) but you should tell her that her daughter needs a behavioral evaluation.
There's a reason she's rejected by all her classmates/neighbors and you are seeing the reason why.
Her parents aren't doing her any favors by ignoring her problem.

"Elsie, my daughter and I are still going to the event, but we're going to make it a mother-and-daughter date." If your friend pushes for an explanation, you can say that your girl is so stressed out by her girl's behavior that she needs a break from it, and you're going to provide it.

My guess is that your friend's daughter is crying out for help. Why? I don't know. Professional counseling time? Could be.

People are clueless when it involves their kids. My friend had a daughter when she was 17. I had a niece the same age of the girl. When the girls were about 4, my friend would come to pick up my niece and me. While all 4 of us were walking to the car, I would reach for the passenger door handle. The daughter would forcibly say, "I am sitting in the front". My friend would laugh. My niece and I would get in the back. I had no car, I wanted to ride, I'd go. Nowadays? Hell no. I'd not tolerate such from a child nor a friend.

There is no easy way to handle this, all the easy ways, you lose a friend.

Have you tried good old fashioned reverse psychology? Like with the sugar, a comment like maybe when you are more mature you can control that. Or stronger, or whatever, pick your term. Just basically saying you are right I don't think you can and see if she is inclined to prove you wrong.