How do you deal with friends that are exceptionally needy?
{let the rant begin}
I became friends with a woman because our kids (age 5) enjoyed each other's company but over time I have become increasingly frustrated with her. We have different parenting styles, I am more firm and she is more loose. I don't like my child to be exposed to too much "in your face" lights and sounds stuff (Chuck E Cheese type places) and she loves to take her kid to places like that at least once a week. I keep my child on a tight leash behavior wise, there is no "Aw, all the other kids are throwing sand so it's okay".
Example: We took the kids to lunch after a playdate and this woman allowed her child to climb all over her and speak incredibly loudly in the restaurant. She was climbing around so much that she spilled her drink all over the table and there were bits of food everywhere. I do not let my child act like that, when we dine out it is "butt on the chair and inside voice" and if we drop something we clean it up. During the lunch I was so embarrassed to be associated with a child acting so poorly, when we left I cleaned up the table but the floor was a flat out mess under her child's chair. I feel like when I go out with this woman I need to apologize to everyone for the incredibly poor behavior of her child. When they come to visit I often have to tell the kid not to do something (chase the cat, throw balls in the living room where they could break something, jump on the bed, or enter my bedroom) and this woman hears me ask her child not to do this, and then doesn't correct her child when she starts doing it again 5 minutes later. Or worse, I say, "Don't throw the ball in the living room please, it might knock over the lamp" and the mother will say "Oh, sweetie, how about you just throw the ball on that side of the living room?" The living room is not very large, so there is no "side" that is safely away from something that might get knocked over.
So, I tried to distance myself. I began being noncommittal about playdates, I even went through a period where I was "not available" for two months straight. This woman kept at me though, and eventually I decided she was not going to get the hint so I had two choices: A) be really mean and tell her I didn't like her kid's behavior and I didn't really like her either (she drives me NUTS), or B) try to limit playdates to one a month in a place where we have a little space (a park, an indoor play place, that type of thing versus over someone's house). I really don't want to hurt anyone's feelings, so I decided I could handle her once a month, especially since the kids like each other so much, so I chose B.
The problem is, I agree to a playdate with this woman and less than 24 hours after we've seen each other she is texting me or emailing me asking me if I want to get together on day x, y,or z - these days can be up to a month and a half in advance. I am usually noncommittal, I say I'll email her back closer to the day or I just don’t reply at all (which means I’ll get daily emails/texts until I DO reply).
I don't think there's much I can do that I haven't tried, I was pretty rude during those 2 months of trying to "break up" with her, ignoring messages and saying blow off things like, "Oh, I forgot to reply" when asked about them. This woman just won't take a hint. I can handle her once a month, I am okay with that because my kid really likes her kid, but I feel like when the playdate wraps up I have to dread the "Are you free next wednesday?" message, which is then followed by the, "No? Okay, how about the wednesday after that?" message. I have tried saying I like to keep my calendar open and don't really like to schedule things too much in advance (why would I want to spend $30 to go to a "kidz crazy zone" when it is beautiful outside?)
Occasionally my child will try to emulate her child’s bad behavior and I stop it immediately, I tell my child that “Just because Maria can do it does not mean you can, I am not Maria’s Mommy”.
I’m fed up to my gills, I really don’t want to hurt this woman’s feelings and I know my child would be really upset not to see her child anymore, but at the same time I am feeling so completely smothered and nothing I have tried will give me the space I need. I think once a month for a playdate is perfectly reasonable since we live an hour and a half away from each other. We met through a mutual friend and I should have known something was amiss when this woman asked me for my email so we could let the kids play together sometime.
I guess this isn’t a question so much as a rant, but please, someone tell me I am not the only person who has fallen victim to a needy friend. Is there any way to tell someone like this to back off without being mean about it?
If I am being childish and immature by not wanting to hurt someone's feelings, then I hope I never grow up. Even the most polite way of saying "we're not clicking" is going to hurt her feelings. She is a needy person, I've spoken to her about how I don't like to schedule things too far in advance, and how I am not a super social person and never will be (I like my space, always have and always will).
The trouble is that no matter how many times I say, "I don't know, I'll let you know when the time gets closer, I don't like to schedule too far in advance because you never know what might come up" she keeps coming at me with playdates a month, even two months in advance. I know she does this because she has a need to have her calendar full, she works part time when her child is in preschool and wants every second outside work to be scheduled with extra curricular activities and playdates, when I saw her last she was telling me how the day before she went to the aquarium with so and so, and the day before that she was at a festival with another friend, and tomorrow she's going to go to the children's museum with a different person. I'm just not the type of person that can keep up with that sort of activity, good for her if she can, but I have friends I see for playdates every now and again when something comes up that we all want to attend, or when it's nice out and someone asks us to join them at the park and I am the type of person that can not see someone for a month and be totally okay with that.
Everyone seems to be latching on to the 2 month period where I ignored her, and I said that was rude, it was shortly after I met her a year ago and I was trying to basically let this whole thing slide away without having to sit her down, this woman I had only known for a month or two, and tell her I didn't want to have any more playdates. I honestly though that just not replying and letting her take the hint would be an easier letdown that coming out and telling her to her face that her personality was abrasive to me and our parenting styles were too different. (I had someone do that to me once, I got the hint, in the city it's common to meet people and have a couple playdates before it fizzles off for whatever reason). But, despite what I thought would happen, this woman kept coming at me. Now I get her messages and I don't reply for a day or two (because it's email, or text, and I don't like feeling like I need to make playdate appointments a month in advance), and then I tell her I'll let her know when the time is closer. Last summer we had our family vacation and she knew the day we were returning (she asked, and must have put it into her calendar) because the day we got back, when we were jet-lagged and unpacking, I got a text asking if I wanted to meet up the next day. I just told her I needed time to relax after our trip and she responded with, "How about Thursday the 3rd?"
I have told her that I prefer to schedule a playdate only once a month, stating that I like to keep our calendar open for us to just wander to the park or somewhere if it's nice out, and when it's true I have told her I'm just too busy to schedule anything. Again though, she might take the hint for that particular time, but then she picks it right back up again. The trouble with scheduling so far in advance is that she brings her child even when she's sick because they've had it planned for so long, so I've been pretty adamant about not scheduling more than a week and a half in advance. Even when we have something scheduled she will contact me, almost in a frenzy, when one of her other people cancels, because I honestly think she just needs to fill time slots with stuff. She doesn't really seem capable of enjoying a nice week at home just playing in the yard or at the local park, she needs something scheduled at all times, and it usually has to be something "big".
I realize that this wouldn't be nearly as frustrating if I had just successfully "broken up" with her when I first started to see signs that we weren't meshing, but I didn't want to hurt her feelings and I honestly thought that I could get it down to once a month like most of my other friends with kids do. I thought that if I backed off she'd find someone else to latch onto. I just didn't realize that she has lots of other people she's latched onto, many who met her online when she messaged them from some sort of birth forum website asking if they wanted to meet up and somehow she manages to schedule them all in. Right now I'm doing once a month because I am "busy," so it's working, I only have to see her once a month, but the problem is that I am constantly being bombarded with invitations to playdates for every other week in the month. For a period I even told her I couldn't meet her far from my home (meaning she would have to do the hour and a half drive if she wanted to see us) I thought that would get her to back off, with traffic in the city that isn't a pleasant drive, but she actually did it, on one occasion I told her I couldn't meet her because I had to be somewhere at 5pm, (her kid had preschool that afternoon) and she said she would still come for a short visit, I urged her not to because it was such a hike, but she insisted and drove the hour and a half, played for an hour, and then drove home in rush hour traffic (which took just over 2 hours).
A couple of your replies have been helpful and sometimes it's nice just to know that other people have had to deal with this. For the others that felt the need to attack me, I see that it would be easy for you to be mean to someone, but it's just not in my nature to hurt someone's feelings, even if it makes me feel pressured to do something I don't want to do.
And to the person who said they thought I thought I was "better than this woman," I never said that - unless you're reading our different parenting styles and projecting your own issues onto them, I don't see how describing how I like to keep things calm and simple and this woman likes to have LOTS of stimulation, and I don't let my child act like a wild animal in a restaurant (because honestly, who of you lets their child climb on tables in a restaurant and throw food all over, I bet most people would be embarrassed by that) and how I have rules I stick to while this woman is very permissive is saying I'm better than her. But hey, if you want to believe that I'm a snooty booty because I don't let my kid interrupt adults when they are talking, I don't let him ignore rules I set, I don't let my child be disrespectful to other diners in a restaurant, and if someone asks my child not to do something in their home I make sure he doesn't do it, then more power to you, but if it's all the same, I'll just keep on being snooty and making sure my kid learns boundaries and socially acceptable behavior.
She doesn't sound needy at all, she sounds confused.
Stop worrying about how it looks and tell her the truth. Sorry but ignoring someone and then saying I forgot to reply is leading her on. You are sending a boat load of mixed signals, stop doing that and tell her you only have time for one playdate a month.
It's very hard to have it four or five different ways, isn't it?
The part that jumps out at me is that you say your child really enjoys spending time with her child. Now, if that is going to be something worth mentioning here, it seems like it's something you value and want to respect. So, I'm not going to pass any judgement on what you've done or what you've said, I am going to offer some honest suggestions and guidelines.
1. Locations should absolutely be neutral ground. You decide you are taking the kids to the park, take some initiative and text the other mother and say, "We're going to X if you would like to join."
2. Pace yourself, don't let her try to do it. You determine how often you can stand her company and again take the initiative to implement that schedule. Say you can hang with her once a month or so, make a regular playdate with location options. Keep it simple and active. If you have to cancel, have a contingency alternative option. But keep it simple. "We can't do X, but how do you feel about alternative A? If that doesn't work for you, we'll just see you next time X rolls around."
3. Utilize every teaching moment. Your daughter will be exposed to SO MUCH in her life you don't want her to emulate. Now is the time for her to learn she can be her own person, and respect your rules; That she need not do everything her friends do. If you only hang out with Stepford Children, those learning opportunities are fewer and less powerful.
4. Get over the embarrassment. (Part of this will be addressed by keeping the location appropriate for your needs.) When I was in labor with my son, people walking in and out of the room while I am writhing in pain, my nethers on display, trying desperately to pass gas to relieve some of the pressure.... I decided that embarrassment was a thing of the past for me. Who cares what other people, strangers, think? It's not your kid. It's not your issue. Stop adopting the problem.
These steps will help avoid any sort of nasty confrontation and still fulfill what seem to be your priorities.
Good luck to you.
Well she may be driving you crazy, but you aren't doing this thing any good by dancing around and not being honest. What is worse than someone IGNORING you and not replying to your texts? I hate that. That is the epitomy of RUDE. If you want to get your life back, you're going to have to be mature about this. Tell her how you feel. Heck, print out your post and give it to her. She needs to know. That's the only way this will stop. Quit stringing her along.
L., I suggest that she will never be able to just "take a hint". I think that you just need to decide exactly what the least problematic playdate is and ONLY accept that playdate. I would NEVER go to a restaurant with her and her child - ever. (I can't stand that either, really and truly.) If the park works, that's a better alternative. Choose a time of day that not as many people are there, too...
You shouldn't be mean. But you don't have to accept dates you don't want. As the weather turns warmer, maybe you can accept twice a month. When she texts for you to get together next week, text back that you can get together two weeks later. You don't have to offer excuses. Just stick to your guns.
If you decide to have "the talk", just tell her that your parenting styles are so different that you have a huge headache when the playdates are done, and that is why you don't want more than twice a month (or whatever you choose.) If she asks for clarification, tell her that kids crawling all over a restaurant throwing food in the floor, chasing the cat in your house, running all over so that you are afraid they will break something, etc, is just too much for you. Then stop talking and just look at her. Then the ball is in HER court.
Be gentle but dispassionate. Maybe she will never call you again. Sounds like you wouldn't mind that much. You will most likely be doing her a big favor. I'll bet she's needy because no one else will have playdates with her.
I know that when my kids were younger, they were full of too much energy and I watched them like a hawk when we were on playdates. Even with me working hard on keeping their behavior in check, they were very spirited. With friends whose children were not so spirited, I'm sure my kids gave them some headaches. The difference was that I didn't just "let" my kids act like that...
Good luck,
Dawn
You have a perfect excuse with them living so far away but I'd just say after the next playdate in a nice but exasperated voice "Suzy! You're too much!! I can't plan so many playdates and so far in advance!! I will call you next for a playdate. Probably the end of next month." That is if you are ok with once a month. Then actually plan one for a month later. Maybe if you have it on the calendar she won't bug you. Just avoiding her is annoying from her POV. Of course she could take the hint but easier to just make a plan. If she still keep bugging you before the date, ignore her the first few times and then reply "Suzy! You're driving me absolutely crazy! We're getting together X/15th. Save it until then!" I don't think you're really being rude but it would be kinder to set a date and that should help. If you don't want to ever see her again, then make that clear. But if your child would be upset, you might have to. There was a mom who bugged me to death for a while but her daughter is/was my daughter's BFF so I dealt with it and now I pretty much like her...
wow! so your only options are to suffer in silence, or to be rude about it?
i myself have no use for the ignore/passive-aggressive/endless excuse thing.
she sounds like a nightmare. i'm a pretty relaxed parent in a lot of ways, but not in a way that encourages a little to behave like a hairy-assed ape. i wouldn't want to hang with her either.
but i can, without even trying, think of a dozen truthful and courteous things to say.
khairete
S.
To answer your question - Yes.
You can try the following. Pick up the phone, or invite her out for coffee and say the following. While our kids seem to have a lovely time together, I am having a hard time with their playdates. Our parenting styles are different, our preferred activities are different, and even our manner of scheduling is different.
Now you have a choice-
1. you can say that because it isn't working out for you, you won't be joining her/ her kids/ having playdates anymore.
2. you can carry on having play dates, but stave off what you regard as intrusive scheduling.
What do you say you let me take the lead on both scheduling and activities for the next six months. Then make a show of your good intentions by saying, are you avail on the 2nd weds in April? Let's pencil in a playdate at the park if its pleasant and a trip to the library's story time if its inclement. We'll touch base on the Monday before hand to see what the forecast holds and that everyone is in good health and able to make it.
Good luck to you and yours,
F. B.
PS-
I wonder if you would feel the same way about this woman's scheduling and communication tendencies if you got on like a house on fire.
I suggest that you be honest with her and tell her about the differences in your parenting syle and how you feel, using I statements, when her kid does such and such. Be kind. Talking about what bothers you is NOT being mean unless you do it in a mean way.
You have nothing to lose. If she takes offense and doesn't want to continue the relationship you were heading in that direction already.
Because you live so far apart once a month is reasonable. However, if you don't talk with her you're still faced once a month with the same issues. I'd work on the relationship. And I'd say, once a month is all you want to get together. You don't have to give a reason. See if when you set a firm boundary if she will then stop texting so much.
I also suggest that she's not acting so needy. It sounds like she enjoys your company and wants to get together more often than is comfortable for you. Being honest with her will take care of that issue.
after reading your 'what happened' i won't bother read the responses. sounds like a lot were not helpful. i see your point. you sound like me. out of control kids are just not my thing. i do however think you are worrying too much about the neediness of this woman, or friend, or whatever you want to call it. just be honest. call her up and say i would love to do things with you from time to time but frankly i am battling with a few things and i wanted to discuss them with you to see what you think. tell her that even though your children are young, you like to keep things under control and respect others who may be subjected to your children when you are out, which means meal at a restaurant means just that, sit, use crayons, eat your meals and be done, no food fights, no walking around, screaming etc.
and then list everything that you do not approve of. in the end she will either make excuses at which point you say i am sorry i just can't bring myself to go out again under these circumstances, or 2. she will acknowledge and offer a solution. 3. she may be pissed and then good riddance.
good luck.
An hour and a half drive to meet up with someone you dislike? Forgetaboutit.
"I'm sorry, I'm going to pass on future get-togethers, as I've found that we really aren't compatible."
Short, to the point.
I also have difficulty being up front and blunt so I feel your pain. Just keep putting her off. Do not accept any invites. Use whatever excuse you can think of. You said you live 1.5 hours from her. Play that one up, gas prices, don't like to drive that far, need to be back by a certain time, etc. Good luck! And people on this site can be very mean and live to lash out. I've had it happen to me. Try not to take it personally :)
I agree with the other people who responded here in that you're going to have to be honest...because she is obviously too dense to figure it out. However, I don't agree with them attacking YOU for being rude...you attempted to be acquaintances with this woman because you have children of similar age who play well together, but that doesn't mean you're now committed to be her BFF. You are being non-confrontational and this woman has boundary issues. It seems to me SHE is the one being rude...she's not taking the hint, is imposing on your time, she put you in the awkward position of having to discipline HER child, not to mention the fact that SHE TOLD HER CHILD TO DISOBEY YOU IN YOUR OWN HOUSE...I think you've been more than patient with this woman, and she is being pushy because she sees you as the kind of person who will put up with it.
I read some of the answers and just wanted to let you know that I was on your side. I'm confused why others think you're the bad guy. You are clearly a nice person who wants to spare this lady's feelings. Nothing wrong with that. You tried the let it fizzle technique. It didn't work.
I would suggest that after her next text, you call her on the phone and tell her that while you have appreciated her friendship for your child's sake, it's just not a relationship you want to continue to pursue. Then stop talking. No need for reasons or excuses. Wish her well and hang up. You've made yourself clear and can move on with a clear conscience. When she continues to call/text you, you can ignore them knowing you've said your bit.
It's terribly hard, but she will get over it. And she seems to have plenty of other friends to console her. Good luck! And please don't let the crappy, judgmental replies from certain mamas affect you. They probably saw themselves in the description of the crazy lady! Ha!
I agree you could find things to say that are more direct than "hints" that she is clearly not getting. And also realize that unless you break up with her, which you seem to not want to do, that she will continue to push over your faint boundaries. You can try "I am holding off making
social plans right now, I have a lot going on I need to take care of. Please wait until you hear from me to make a plan. When I'm ready for an invitation I'll let you know." Then when she texts or emails you delete them and move on with your day.
Not everyone has your parenting style, let her be!! I cannot stand any other parent telling my child what not to do or do!! I'm not an idiot!! You need to be up front with her, your misleading in so many ways!!
How about taking control of the schedule and ask her if a month out works. Plan something at a park or indoor play area, as you have been and keep it short and sweet. 2 hours max, then go home. Sounds nice of you to tolerate it as long as you have. I say, control where you go and limit the time. No going out to eat unless it's a picnic in the park where neatness matters less.
My sage wisdom would be to say that very very often freindships in chldhood like this fade off and you'll have several playdate friends that last for a bit and then someone else will take their place. So don't feel bad that your child will miss their playmate because there will be others and probably others that are a better fit.
if her child will be starting school soon there is a good chance it will fade. especially with the distance.
To be honest, my mind is blown that it hasn't faded YET. So i'm wonderign what is going on with her personality. You've done what you can to make it difficult for her. AND YET she still persists. So is it your kid she is comign to see or is it you?? or is it just like you said she needs someone to fill her time. waht's that about ?? maybe you can direct her to a different activity that she could meet new people at and you can fade off.
I"m shy and introverted enough that I do tend to be rude to protect myself. so I dont usually get into this position but I can sure relate to not wanting playdates as often as others but they generally get the hint.
Wow. I think this question and answer session wins longest responses, hands down. You've hit a nerve somewhere.
The age of five is so different than the age of seven regarding play dates. Two years isn't long.
Just recently I realized that my mom spent a considerable amount of time on play dates with my brother's friends' moms, but not mine. When I asked her about it, she told me she didn't like the moms of my classmates. "So and so thought she was so superior, blah, blah, blah."
Yet, when it comes down to it, I had a lot fewer opportunities to play with friends than my brother had. Obviously, this still stings.
Who else does your child play with? If not many others, this may bring up a different point to consider.
It is commendable that you do not want to hurt this other person's feelings. She's not taking the hint because she enjoys your company and wants to be friends.
Like so many others have said, I'd accept a play date once a month, tops, in a neutral area, not involving food (since that especially bothers you). Just tell her that you are a busy person (who isn't?) and that you just can't commit to more than once a month or so, especially given that you live one-and-one-half hours away from each other. I have a close friend from high school that lives that distance away, and I see her twice a year! Where do you find the time for more frequently than that? And is there any way that "mutual friend" can be at the same play date? Hard to believe you haven't discussed this situation with that person.
Once your kids are in elementary school and are meeting friends there, this friendship will slip away.
L.,
You have been sooo patient! You don't have to do playdates anymore. It sounds like this woman has completely different moral values and well everything.
Tell her that you have enjoyed getting together but you are really busy and getting together more than once a month or every other month, is too much for you. (If you want to keep the relationship).
If you don't....tell her that you appreciate the time you have spent together but you are not interested in pursuing the friendship any longer. When she asks why, you can tell her that her child's behavior is atrocious and you are embarrassed for her. Maybe this tough love and brutal honesty will be a wakeup call to her----Don't let yourself be suckered into anything you don't want. GL
Just be honest with her. You can do it in a polite and tactful way without being rude.
I had to get rid of a "friend" who had the same non-parenting style and same type of kids. Right down to the being embarrassed to be in public with them and her. To top it all off, her kids were horrible to DD. She was always all over wanting to do something, also, like your friend. She was also an angry, bitter, drama queen, so I had no issues tellingl her to take a hike.
It sounds like you need to be direct with her. What you're doing isn't working. Just tell her that you feel like you need to move on from the friendship because you're just too different and that it's nothing personal.
Don't feel bad that your child will be losing a playmate. It probably would've fizzled out anyway, and with so many worthy people out there, why waste your time with "friends" that drain and annoy you?
Some people just do not take hints. Did you tell her you can only see her once a month or so, or did you skirt around the issue? It sounds like you will have to be blunt: "Judy, things have been so busy lately that I can't commit to future dates. I will call you in a month or so if some time frees up". If she chooses to hound you, ignore her calls. You would have told her politely that you're not available. If you really would prefer not to see her again, you can politely tell her that as well: "Judy, as the kids have gotten older, I've noticed that we don't have the same parenting philosophies. I've tried to work around this, but have become increasingly bothered by these differences. It's hard for me to teach my child the proper way to behave when she sees your child misbehaving in restaurants, at our house etc...I think it would be best if we no longer get together. Take care!"
You are just going to have to come out and tell her bluntly. You don't like her so why continue to be nice to her and have the relationship turn your stomach into knots? There will be other kids your son will play with. This just the beginning of friends.
If you do live an hour and a half away I would find a new playmate for your child closer.
Good luck be honest and be done with the woman and child. Life is too short for such nonsense.
the other S.
You could tell her you have a phone plan that doesn't allow for many texts an you would appreciate if she would limit it to the day before scheduled play date to confirm. Your phone plan is to limit her texts!
