Needing Some Advise from Moms

1) The less he sees / "has" his daughter, the MORE he pays in child support. You do NOT pay to see your kids. You pay for their care. Either when they are with you, or with someone else.

2) Very few parents are happy to see their ex during 'their' time with the kids. If your fiancé is just showing up whenever he happens to feel like it, MOST moms would be ticked off. It's disruptive, rude, self centered, and a lot more besides.

3) Even fewer would be happy to see their ex with their girlfriend in tow. Doesn't matter how nice you are. It's a pain in the neck for most kids of divorce to have to deal with the love interest of the moment... Which makes it a pain in the neck x10 for mom. Especially when dad has no interest in kids EXCEPT when his girlfriend does, or has already brought 3, 4, 20 women around over x years. Or during the few times he has the kids is shoving them off on said girlfriend, or is ignoring the kids for said girlfriend. Even if your fiancé does none of these things... This is what is going through a mom's mind. Totally legitimate until proved otherwise (doesn't sound like your fiancé has proved otherwise, yet).

4) To go from giving up his rights to wanting custody puts mom through the WRINGER. On both scores.

To me it sounds like dad either needs to step up and get something kind and consistant going... Or at the very least needs to stop putting this family through hell (pushing them away, showing up at random times, showing up at random times with girlfriend, pushing them away then demanding time).

Yes. Go for visitation. Not as a threat... But as the decent thing to do. If mom has full custody he needs to STOP just showing up, and get something consistent going that everyone can count on, and be there when he says he's going to be. Or to sign away his rights and leave them be. Or to not sign away, and pay... But stay away and stop this selfish attitude of showing up and disrupting their lives.

How do you know the daughter wants to see your fiance? How do you know the mother is putting bad things in her head? Seriously, you say these things but how do you know?

If your fiance wanted to be in her life, he would have consulted an attorney and gone to court years ago. If he truly wants to have contact with her, that's what he will do now. Pretty simple.

No personal experience but .....Showing up at someone's home is rude. Mom does not want to be around her ex. So why hasn't the ex, your fiance, arranged a third party to handle pick up and drop off? 9 year olds are capable of forming their own opinions of people without parent's input. Could be your fiance started acting like a devoted dad to impress you. It happens. If he really wants to in his child's life why is he talking about giving up rights? Go to court for visitation.

Yes, get an attorney. Learn the actual facts on this. I don't think you're getting the whole story. If a man REALLY wanted to see his daughter, he would be fighting in court, for his legal rights. It sounds to me, that he possibly gave up his rights...now would like them back.

The only advice I can give, is learn the truth. Even if the truth means learning really nasty things about their split, and your boyfriend. This seems a bit fishy, and a bit convenient of an explanation for him. Be perpared to learn things about your boyfriend.

He needs to be there for the child he created.
Normally support and visitation are two separate issues.
Because he pays, that does not "buy" him visits.
He needs to get a court-ordered visitation agreement.
She's 9. What's he waiting for?!!

I can't. Sorry. I don't know the mother's side of things. I don't know the "real" reason they broke up. I don't know what kind of man your fiance is.
But I will tell you this.
My son's bio-dad was a looser. Why I even hooked up with him, I will never know. He did drugs, drank, and cheated on me left and right. I got pregnant. He wanted me to abort. I kept the baby. He disappeared for 3 years.
When he came back I came to him and he signed over his rights. (like what your fiance wants to do) But, when he was signing everything he kept asking if he could be in his life. NOPE. Sorry bub, you lost your chance when you walked out for 3 years. Then he EASILY signed over his rights.
The fact that you say that your fiance wants to give up his rights doesn't sit well with me.
I will tell you that if my son's bio-dad all the sudden decided that he wanted to see my son after 10 years he would have a HELL of a fight on his hands...and I don't care if his fiance thinks he's a good man or not.
L.

I am confused -

Has he given up his rights? Legally, in court? If so he needs to hire an attorney and petition to get his rights back. Once that is achieved then he can have formal child support and visitation agreements drawn up.

If he still has legal rights and is just paying child support on his own - with no court docs in place - he still needs to hire an attorney and go to court.

Also your words "when ever my fiancé shows up where the 9 year old and her mother are at" just sounds stalker-ish. Does he follow them? How does he know where they are going be? Maybe he is making the Mother so uncomfortable that she is leaving when she sees him. Um, especially if he sign away his parental rights.

Please give us some clarity in your SWH. Thanks.

Wiebs:

Welcome to mamapedia!!!

I'm sorry that your fiance is going through this.

In MY opinion, the biological mother has NO RIGHT to keep the child from her father unless he has endangered her or would be a danger to her.

If it were me? I would petition the courts to get court ordered visits. He and his daughter NEED to know each other. She needs to know he loves her and cares.

The biological mother is showing her true colors and her own insecurities by NOT allowing the child see her father AND putting stuff in her head. Encourage him to take her to court for court ordered visits.

Best of luck to you!

Hmm how long do you know your fiance? How long has it been since he separated from his ex family? How old was the kid when that happened?
If he really wants to be with his daughter, why didn't he go to court earlier and get visitation rights? 9 years is a long time ! It all depends on what has transpired between them in the past, the reason for the break up and why the mom got full custody.
Are you sure he is not trying to impress you by feeling bad about it. I mean, if he really feels bad , I am sure he would have gone to court years ago. Why did he not do that all these years?
I don't know why the mom doesn't want her kid to be around dad , can't say if she is doing the right thing or not unless we hear the story from her side. Sorry!
Please ask your fiance to see a lawyer and you should stop feeling so bad about it. Just leave it to him to handle it.

It sounds like your fiancee gave up his visitation rights and now wants them back. It can be done but isn't the easiest argument to win.

You need to get an attorney and lay out the facts, even the ugly ones, they will be able to advise you, not us.

He needs a formal court order of visitation rights and abide by that schedule. That's the way to protect his rights.

Whatever you do, do not talk to the 9 year old about setting the visittion schedule. Childen should not carry the burden of adults' problems. The visitation situation is between her mother and father, and the resolution is to let the court set visitation so that there is not need to fight about it.

I went thru this with an ex. He only had 2 hrs a dy for 2 dys every other wknd. I encouraged him to get an attny after he spoke to my gf who is a paralegal in family law. He hired the attny she works for n got more visitation. His CS payment was reduced. We ended up splitting up but remained friends. He contd to take her court for more n more time over the yrs n after 7 yrs he ended up losing all of his time n was ordered supervised visitation due to poor choices in parenting n the fact that his son was scared of him. I learned that as much as you think you know someone, unless you are the one who has a child with him, you don't know the circumstances of why things are so, and just to remain out of it. After learning about everything, I regretted my decision to encourage his visitation and retain a lawyer. After all, before I had met him, he had never been proactive in any attempts to take her to court. He was content with what he had, in my opinion, since he had only spoke of wanting more time for 7 yrs and never acting on it. His son was 7 when I came into the picture. We ended up breaking up because he was jealous of the relationship I had with his son, and did not like the fact that I made more money than he did.
Your situation may be different, but this is my experience.

Best of luck

He can go to court and file to get visitation-he may have to pay a filing fee-it's not exorbitant. It is his responsibility to pay support for his child even if he is not having visitation. It is his moral obligation to treat the mother of his child with decency and civility. It sounds to me like you don't know the whole story-she is still fuming mad and holding a big grudge against your fiance and maybe he hasn't told your everything? My advice-make friends with the ex-you are all going to have to work together to co-parent the little girl. I also strongly suggest that the girl be encouraged to get as much education as possible, so that she doesn't struggle her entire life-and I don't just mean financially-I mean emotionally, as well. Best of luck!

Sounds like he probably needs to go to court to get visitation. Custody fights can be very ugly--I would encourage you to let this be between your fiance and the girl's mom.

The mom has no right to keep the child from her father. The court will definitely understand this and will take his side, especially since he's diligently paying child support and is seeking to be with his daughter. The only thing keeping him from her is if the mom can prove he's a danger. You don't need to elaborate on that, just keep it in mind.

As for the mom putting bad things in the daughter's head, shame on her but keep your head high and don't resort to doing the same. Be a great family and she will love her father for it no matter what her mom says. In time she will understand her mom's cruelty and actually it may back fire on her sooner rather than later, kids get defensive.

I don't think he should purposefully attend somewhere they are at. Just get that court order so the mom can't keep them apart and he can spend time with him and the daughter without the mom around. I'm really sorry you have to go through this, some people just don't understand that you put your child first, your feelings about your ex last.

He needs to get an attorney and take her to court. If he already has court mandated visitation, the mom needs to follow these rules or he should contact the court and they will enforce them.

This child is suffering and he has a legal right to her. If there is a court order in effect all he has to do is notify her he wants to have his weekend...what ever it says, including the time and place he is picking her up and for her to be ready, take the court order with him, then if she does not allow him to take her or something else is going on he can call the police for help to make her obey the court order.

She is in effect breaking the law if she is not obeying a court order. The police in my town have actually gone into my ex son in laws home and took my grandson out of some one's arms, brought him outside, and handed him to my daughter. Then of course you have to deal with a woman going crazy all weekend. Once she gets the child back you can pretty much guarantee she is going to skip town or file new papers for different court orders, she'll pay him back one way or the other.

But if she is this unstable it might be a good thing if they do go to court. I would make sure he talks to an attorney before doing anything that will set her off the deep end...lol. He is her father and has a legal right to her until a court of law says he does not have that right.

Even if he terminates his rights he needs to see her and talk to her about the why and that he does care for her. Not wanting to deal with the mom is a valid reason for not seeing her I suppose. They could set up the exchange where neither one of them is present. They each pick a representative and do the exchange at someplace like the yard of the police department. Then if there is any issue the police are handy.

I did this with my ex son in laws mom a few times. Then my daughter and the dad were able to start doing it themselves.

What does his visitation order read? If there is a court order in place with scheduled visitation and the mother is not complying with that, he can and should take her to court for violating a court order. While it's nicer and easier if he has an attorney, if he can't afford one, then this is something he can do easily enough on his own. He can go to the clerk's office of family court and they'll tell him what forms to fill out (or he can find this information on-line). He will have to document all of the times that he was not allowed to see his daughter so that he has evidence when he goes to court.

If for some reason he does not have court-ordered visitation, he needs to file a complaint for modification with family court to establish visitation. Again, lawyer is nice but don't let that get in the way if he can't afford one as this is also a simple request. He will need to fill out the paperwork, pay a small fee to file the complaint and have the mother served with the complaint, then once she is served and he has proof of service, they will move ahead with scheduling a court date. He'll have to propose a reasonable visitation schedule before filing the papers.

The only caution against going to court is if he has something to worry about - outstanding warrants, a negative court history (things like arrests, any domestic violence in his past, fights with his ex), owing back child support etc. and in that case, he should consult with an attorney first. Otherwise if he is a decent person with no criminal background, has kept current on his child support and there's no reason to prevent visitation, this should be a pretty simple procedure.

The ONLY way to ensure that he gets visits is to go to court and have a judge order her to allow visits. And don't settle for "reasonable visitation" because what's reasonable to one person may not be so reasonable to another. Get it spelled out, especially for holidays, birthdays (his and the child's), father's day, etc.

I hate when women do this!! Your fiance has every right to see his child especially if he's been paying child support!!! He needs to take her to court!!!

I know people are going to jump on me for saying this but I don't think the fathers get enough help from the courts in this country!! If he fathered that child then she's 50 percent his!!! It gets me so angry when everything is so one sided toward the mom!!! Plus, there should be some laws that prevent women from bad-mouthing the fathers - ESPECIALLY when they are trying to be good fathers!!!

Be sure he's documenting everything so he can back up his side of the story!! And, not to step on any toes - but has there been a paternity test to prove she is his? That will definitely help his case in getting visitations!!

Good luck!!!

I'm sory but I should say you need to stay out of it. Be supportive to him and love the child when she is in your house. You see your side of the situation and not the mom's. The two of you have two totally different view points. Now if the dad wants visitation he will need to take mom to court, which you say hes planning. You say he has court ordered visitation now, but does he have specific dates and times or is it just open ended where there are no times? It does make a difference. Also you mention the fact that he doesn't see the child yet pays to take care of her. Well these are two totally different things and paying has nothing to do with seeing the child. Most areas will not let a father give up rights if there is not another man who is willing to adopt. It sounds kind-of like hes mad to have to pay child support to take care of his child that he helped create since this was your first tihng mentioned. I'm sorry but if the child is seen or not he still needs to take care of her financially. You do not want to make it harder for the child. It's hard enough with her playing ping pong between bickering parents. Also stay out of it or you may have three people who wond up being upset with you.

Take the mom to court. Get the court ordered child support amount established and court ordered visitation schedule. He's doing his bit to show he wishes to be a good father and wants in his child's life so he needs to take the next step and get it all legalized beings the mom isn't being civil. Take it to family court and get it done. His daughter deserves both their parents.

I have never gone through this, but it is confusing to me when you say that he wants to give his rights up, yet he is talking about taking the mother to court for court order visitations.

He needs to see a lawyer about this and find out exactly what his rights are. He may STILL have to pay child support if he gives up his rights. What would be the point of giving up his rights if he still has to pay? Is he paying the COURT? Or is he paying her directly? The judge will not give him any credit at all for paying if he isn't paying to the court.

Usually child support and child visitation are not dependent on each other. If he hasn't gotten the court to order visitation for him, that's his fault. He needed to have done it. He needs to tell the judge she is talking badly about him. His lawyer would help him.

Until he goes to court, he isn't going to get anywhere with this. He needs to get a lawyer now.

Dawn