My Son's Behavior - Cleveland,TX

Oh Amy J., you just sent me straight back to my childhood!

We had to organize the linen closet or the pots and pans cabinet. It was a highly effective consequence!

He may be more attuned to learning visually than audibly. Telling him "after dinner brush your teeth while I clean up and then you get in the shower and go upstairs" may sound like a hundred confusing things to him. It may not be a disability, just the way his brain thinks. Like if I told you "while I balance the checkbook you go to the store and we need peanut butter and the laundry has some stains that need pre-treating and there's a good movie on tonight, ok and did I tell you you got a phone call?" Wait, wait, wait. Slow down there!

So try this: stop talking. Make some index cards. With a permanent marker, write down one chore. "Brush your teeth". Laminate the card if you want, or put clear shipping tape over it so it doesn't get soggy. If you want to, find some computer clip art of a kid brushing his teeth. Make more index cards such as "get pjs on", "feed the dog", "take a shower", "sit and do your homework". Give your son one card and tell him to hold it and do it while you set a timer. When the timer rings, he should bring the card back to a designated spot (a basket on the counter, for example) and you give him the next card. If it helps, glue a clue onto the card (a small toothbrush, a hotel size bar of soap, a little foam or felt pj shape) for more tactile reinforcement. And only tell him one thing at a time. Be brief, direct and simple. Take one card, do one thing in a reasonable amount of time before the timer rings, return the card and do the next thing. Eventually it will go smoothly and more quickly.

I did this with my son after I sent him to the car to get my purse and he came back in the house 20 minutes later and said something like "I looked everywhere mom but there's no bike in the yard". There was nothing wrong with this kid's brain - he just went outside to get the purse and saw the yard and, well, who knows what paths his brain took. It's like that old "Family Circus" cartoon where the little kid's footsteps are shown. He is headed from the couch to the table but first he goes to the garage and to the dog house and to his room and he looks at a leaf and explores a caterpillar, and plays with some blocks and makes a fort out of sticks for the caterpillar and then he finally ends up at the table. My son's teacher wrote him a permanent index card which she would place on his desk that said "stop humming out loud", after telling him sixty zillion times to stop humming. One look at the card, and he would stop humming.

It doesn't sound like your son is disobeying, just getting distracted. Tune into his way of focusing, work with it, and reduce everyone's frustration!

7 and 8 yr olds are terrible. They are just figuring out that they can control some situations but they haven't figured out that they don't control all situations. Don't play his game.

Right now he knows that he's the boss until you yell. No you are always the boss. When you tell him to do something and he doesn't do it on the first request you need to stop what you are doing, go to where he is, and tell him that you've asked nicely and now he needs to comply or be placed in time out for 7 minutes.

He's a good kid and its normal behavior but this is one of those phases where you are to actively parent him and enforce your rules. Once he gets a little older he'll be better ... until the next obnoxious phase. lol

He is only 7 and I bet he doesn't get that much exclusive attention from you. Instead of telling him 10 times to go brush his teeth, go with him to the bathroom and tell him a story while he brushes. It will honestly be faster and it will be a positive experience for both of you. My son is 8 and we still get him ready for bed together (or DH does). It is part of his bedtime routine - and I suspect when he is older you will miss it. Please try not to make him feel like there is something wrong with him.

There is a ridiculous amount of sitting still in school today. Many kids are kinetic learners - our public school is very interested in whether the kids are kinetic, auditory, visual, etc learners and makes attempts to make sure they ALL learn. Perhaps using a yoga ball (lots of schools are using them instead of regular seats) for seating will help with the fidgeting. Also - how often are the kids getting up and moving around. In my son's second grade class, they were rarely in the same seats for more than 20 minutes at a time - if that. They moved to various parts of the room, worked in groups, went to gym, lunch, music, etc.

Kids are expected to sit still and listen for a long time. Is there anything other than moving his desk that she is doing with him? Can he use a yoga ball for a chair? Or a piece of fabric for a foot hammock? Can she write down his tasks so he has a visual checklist?

I would read a book like How to Talk So Kids Will Listen and look at topics like how to discipline without punishing. It's a weird concept at first, but it uses things like natural consequences vs spankings. Things that teach the child what TO do vs just not to do.

It is easy to get upset with a child that just won't...but maybe if you gave him a short checklist (that he helps you create) or you give him simple reminders like now it's time to brush teeth...now it's time to pick out pjs...he'll get into better habits. I cannot tell my DD "clean your room". I need to break it down. If he needs to you take him to the bathroom and watch him brush while you brush the other kids' teeth, so be it. Then it's done, at the same time, and nobody's yelling.

And maybe he learns differently than other kids. I'm very auditory. But that meant that dog sick or not, I had to be IN class or it was hard to grasp a concept. I could look like I wasn't paying you any mind, but I was listening. I also have DD do one thing at a time. One page of math. Break. One book review. Break. Can you let him have any choice over it? Do all the evens, take a break, do all the odds?

What I would not do is make him feel like a broken kid. He may not know why he does what he does and needs help. It's hard being a kid sometimes. I try to remember that my DD is only 6 and she has to remember all the morning routine, everything at school, not get upset about anything, stop playing all the time because there's a Must Do...she's lamented that it's hard. So tell him you love him and want to work through this with him and see what you and he and the teacher can come up with. And also don't be afraid to ask the guidance office for advice. "Teacher says that my son's behavior annoys other children. Do you have resources we could use at home?" And when I really need DD to listen, I get to her level, I say it right at her, and I have her repeat it. That's something I saw her teachers use and it seems to help.

Hang in there. Nobody's perfect. ;)

My son has ADD - loves to read, huge reader. Kids with ADD can absolutely focus if it's something they are interested in. Biggest mistake I ever made was listening to a teacher who told me the exact same thing your son's teacher told you and delayed getting him evaluated. We ended up doing medication (son's ADD is impulsive, not inattentive, and the meds have made a world of difference).

My daughter, who has not been formally diagnosed with ADD but scores high on every ADD test I've given her, sounds like your son. For us it's not interfering with school to a large extent so we've not pursued diagnosis/treatment, however if it did we would pursue.
Checklists help, a lot, with inattentive kids - the visual reminder works very well. Make a checklist for home and have him check off each item when he's done. You can do the same for school if he's having trouble remembering to bring things home. As to staying on task, see if the teacher will allow him to read when he's done with tasks. If so, she can keep his book on her desk where he can see it as a visual reminder that when he's done he gets to read. That might help. Also ask your son for recommendations, what does he think will help him? You'd be surprised how intuitive kids are, and if he's involved in the process he'll feel more ownership over it and the outcome.

However, if he is crying over this and that behavior is unusual I would get him evaluated by my pedi. One thing my oldest said was the most frustrating thing for him was that he wanted to do better, he knew he had to do better, but he didn't know how and didn't know why he acted the way he did - it was like he couldn't control it. Meds (the right one) have helped him tremendously, he now feels in control. There is no reason for your kiddo to feel like he can't win, and if this is ADD that's a pretty common complaint from kids, that they feel out of control and like they can't win no matter what they do.

My daughter does a lot of these things you are saying about your son. I can't give her several things to do at once because she will forget them and only do one. She is a straight A student too. I will tell her to put her plate in the sink wash her hands and clean up her mess upstairs. She will hear put your plate in the sink. I know to say put your plate in the sink. After she does that I will say wash your hands. She will do that and then I will tell her to clean up upstairs. She is getting better now she will put her plate in the sink and wash her hands but will forget to clean up. Good luck!!

The only thing I want to say about this is that he is only 7, and he sounds like a nice, sweet kid. There are worse things in the world than not putting your shoes away.

It hurts my heart to hear that he started crying and said that he could change. He's just a little guy, and he's trying.

My advice is that once your kids are grown, you will know that so many of those things that you got upset about, or worried about, or obsessed over with your kids, didn't matter at all. I'm thinking that most of the things your son is doing fall under this category.

He's 7, his brain is far from formed, I say just pick up the shoes yourself vs. nagging him ten times, it's quicker and easier. Walk with him into the bathroom and stand there while he brushes his teeth. It will take two minutes.

Really choose your battles; he's just a little guy, he's trying, and this stuff isn't that important. And don't worry if he doesn't get all A's. He certainly shouldn't get spanked for forgetting. Your time with your baby will pass very quickly, and once your kids are grown you won't give a whit about where their shoes were or how quickly they got dressed; but you WILL want to have as many wonderful memories of fun times you spent with them, and you will be sad about times that you were too harsh with them.

hm. well, there are a few possibilities, so i'll just go with what jumps out at me. first off, you tell him 10 times to do something and it still doesn't get done. so clearly just repeating yourself over and over isn't working, is it?
and you've got 3 more kids trundling right along behind him. so you should probably learn this lesson right now. when you are willing to repeat over and over again, your voice becomes completely inaudible.
stop that.
pick your battles.
he's 7, which is a very naturally distractible age, and he has to sit at school for interminable lengths of time. most adults are visual learners, a few are auditory, and almost all kids are kinesthetic until they mature. our educational system is systematically geared to frustrate kids. so please understand that by the end of the day, his 7 year old brain is fried just from having been corralled for so long, so as his mom you HAVE to work with that. not by letting everything go, but by finding ways of getting him to listen without being a charlie brown adult.
so if he has to pick up his shoes, get dressed and brush his teeth, decide which one is the most important. stop him, get down on his level, look in his eyes, and in a QUIET voice tell him which one he needs to do RIGHT NOW. and keep a stern eye on him while he gets started.
if he doesn't follow through, find whatever appropriate punishment follows it. it can be tough with things like getting dressed or putting shoes away, but get creative. you can think of something. if it's his teeth, no treats. if it's not getting ready for bed, he misses out on his story.
if he's so distractible that he can't get from the bathroom door to his toothbrush without genuinely forgetting what he's there for, he does need an evaluation and possibly medication. but i'm betting that he's simply still on the fitz from school, and overloaded with instructions. simplify, simplify, simplify.
and keep in mind that 7 year olds are pretty goofy, as a rule. very few of them are efficient and organized.
as for the teacher, she's taken a good step already by moving his desk. as for the constant reminders, she's in the same boat as you. if she has to ride him like a rodeo bull to keep him on task, it sounds as if he might need a few bad grades or a trip the principal's office as a wake-up call. and if that jolt doesn't work, you're back to getting a diagnosis.
it's a pity, as he sounds like a delightful and smart young fellow who would probably thrive in a setting that let him move and jive and wiggle at will. i've been flummoxed by how much a group of 6-10 year olds will learn when they're permitted to climb and wrestle and jump and play with blocks while a lesson is in progress. the temptation is always to make them sit still and pay attention, so i've been shocked to be educated myself by these young 'uns as to how much they absorb when allowed to learn naturally.
but that's not an option here, so think about helping him double-down on conforming to the institution's rules, and that means the same thing it does at home- consequences as natural as you can keep them.
good luck!
ETA i love elena B's solution!
khairete
S.

Age 7 was when people started noticing there was something not quite typical about our firstborn. We hadn't yet made the connection, being so close to him from birth. Detailed evaluations for ASD, ADD, and other related things opened our eyes and we began doing the things that he needed us to do.

Things like establishing a fixed routines so that everything is predictable and the same. The timing, the order of the tasks, etc. Always the same.

We're currently working on adding deodorant the the morning routine. It's like throwing a wrench into the works and having to resort the gears in his head. For now, I have to remind. Eventually it will stick.

My son loves books and was reading independently at age 4. He was the most advanced reader in his class every year. All it says about your son is that he probably doesn't have a visual processing impairment.

My first thought is maybe he is doing this for attention. You have 4 kids 7 and under...so maybe he feels like he isn't getting enough (not bashing you at all but kids go through times when they crave more attention and then times when they want less and they don't know how to express their needs).

I have a 7 year old daughter who is forgetful and needs reminding. A lot. It isn't so much that she is misbehaving or not listening as she is just kind of off in her own world, thinking deep and strange thoughts. Plus she gets distracted easily by certain things (TV, her sister, computer games).

We realize that we just have to remind her of things often. Yes, it gets annoying but she is as she is. What works for us is to give her a *reward* when/if she completes a task. For example, if you get everything ready for tomorrow and get ready for bed and are in bed by 8:15, I will read a chapter from The Hobbit. When we finish the book I will consider letting you watch the movie. We then have to ask did you brush your teeth? Did you brush your hair? Did you wash? Is your backpack ready to go? Do you have clothes out for tomorrow?

Or, when you are done with dinner you may play a game for 20 minutes. Oh, sorry you can't play yet. Go see if you can figure out what you forgot. Yes, you forgot to put your dishes in the sink. Thank you, now you may play.

Or, I've asked you about 10 times to pick up your boots. I guess you won't be able to play outside with your sister because if I have to pick them up then they become mine for the rest of the day. We'll miss you when we are out.

Good luck. It can be frustrating when you feel like they shouldn't have to be reminded about everyday tasks like brushing teeth.

As for the school... Maybe he's bored? My daughter is well above bench marks and if she didn't get pulled out to do enrichment activities a few times a week and have her teacher give her work at her level she would be bored out of her mind and would have trouble staying on task.

Well, he may have figured out that why should he have to do it?

What I'm saying, what is the consequence if he DOESN'T do these things? Losing the electronics wasn't a good enough "currency" for him to be motivated to earn them back.....

If possible, you need to have some kind of "natural" consequence..... for example, missing an activity he really wanted to do because he couldn't get ready on time.....

For the things left out when they should be put up, I've seen the box where there is a label on it talking about something being left out, and now they have to do a chore to earn it back......

He also knows that at this point, you will continue to remind him to do something, and he apparently doesn't have to do it until you get REALLY mad... he just waits until he hears that certain 'tone' in your voice, and then he does it.

Good luck!

I just wanted to offer that you're not alone. My 7 year old boy sounds pretty similar. He's a good kid, doing well in school academically, but has a hard time focusing - staying on task at school, and paying attention and executing directions. Even for simple things like take the plates to the table, brush your teeth, put your shoes on! It's super frustrating, and it's really like it's gone in one ear, out the other. My son is a great reader, like it sounds like yours is. I think he just gets lost thinking about things he's read about. His mind is working in overdrive, but not on the tasks I want him to focus on.
The only thing I can think of, is that my son is really, really focused when I'm engaging him in an activity and we're talking. Like if getting dressed in the morning is a race, he's good. Or if we're doing his homework together and talking about it, he gets it done fast. But so much of what I'm nagging him to do is stuff that's mundane, tedious - not interesting at ALL to him. So I'm thinking I might need to involve him more in the details of the activity, really engage him somehow - like rally shock him into brushing his teeth - like showing him pictures of decay or something. THAT's something he can get motivated from.

This could be any number of things.

You repeat yourself endlessly - so a) he doesn't have to listen the first time or the 7th time, because there will be 8, 9 , 10 times. He could be stubborn or just gaining independence. He may want to be separate and "older" than the siblings and not have to be told what to do. He may be getting the payoff, which is extra attention (negative though it is) and there's no real incentive to do things different.

He may not be an auditory learner. He may be visual or kinesthetic. So educating yourself about these learning styles instead of getting frustrated and irritated may be much more fruitful. There's an expression that, if kids can't learn in the way we teach, we should teach in the way kids learn.
What's interesting to me is that he can do his worksheets and he can read a lot - those are visual media! He may not be getting his learning through verbal cues, but through what the teacher does on the board or what items are posted on bulletin boards or what instructions are at the top of his worksheet.

The teacher says, because he can read, he doesn't have an attention issue. But she says she can't tell if he's paying attention. He's clearly distractible, she moved his desk, he isn't on task, he annoys other kids, etc. so she really has no way of knowing if he has ADD. I'm concerned a little about the comment that "she genuinely likes him." How did this come up? It's such an unprofessional comment for her to make. She should never be saying that she likes or doesn't like a kid. I'm also a little concerned about the straight As. I'm not sure that's relevant at age 7, or a lofty goal.

Even people who "eat a healthy diet" are missing key nutrients. There is no major medical or food science authority who believes that todays diets are sufficient for kids or adults. Some are worse than others, of course, but the AMA said over a decade ago that everyone is undernourished. So that's not the whole problem, but it could well be a major factor. I work in food science and we've seen huge differences in kids and adults when super foods are added to boost immunity, focus, and epigenetic repair (so that cells function as they are supposed to). The tremendous rise in attention issues, sensory issues and so on are very much on the same time line as the changes in our diets and the effect on the epigenome.

He wants to do well and to please you and the teacher, but he's clearly upset and he knows you all expect him to change on his own. Maybe he can, maybe he can't. But putting this all on him until you really have the answers may set you up for a whole ton of disappointment and frustration. He may be just a stubborn kid, but he may also be truly at a loss, expecting him to fix himself at the tender age of 7.

I'm not convinced that he doesn't have ADD, just because he reads a lot. Kids with ADD can absolutely focus on something they love.

Aside from ADD, I'd be on your son's butt so hard that he would figure out fast that he had better change his tune. NO TV. NO COMPUTER. NO GAMEBOY. I'd get a bunch of play money from TOYS R US and give him $30 at the beginning of the week. I'd tell him that he can earn dollars for doing what you ask him to do the first time you ask. But if he doesn't, you take dollars away from him. He has to have the $30 by the end of the school week in order to have any TV/computer/etc privileges on the weekends. It's a type of token economy system, but also gives punishment at the end of the week if he hasn't tried to do better.

I'd also be following him around the house and watching him until he gets a little better at this. I wouldn't ask more than twice. I'd be all over him not moving out of his way until he did what he was supposed to do, in order for him to see that you mean business.

Nip this in the bud. Soon.

My oldest son has ADD. He is 9 th grade. He has difficulty staying organized. My younger son has some learning disabities. He has always repeated everything mult times. He receives extra help. He is in the rescource room.He is very organized and gets great grades. Please send me a private message I have been where you are.

You've learned one important thing. Natural consequences have more effect that taking away random things that don't have any connection to the behavior.

I suggest you change it all around. Reward him when he does what you ask. Stop focusing on how many times he doesn't do something, reward him when he goes and does it. When ever that is, if he finally remembers to brush his teeth at midnight give her some sort of reward, even a hug for remembering is enough to reinforce his good action.

I'd also tell the teacher thank you for letting me know how things are going in the classroom and that you support her efforts. Then let her do her job. It's HER job to engage him and figure out how to make him pay attention to her. It's NOT your job to manage her classroom time and how she interacts with her students. She has resources that she can call upon that will help her find effective ways to get through to your son. It's HER job to do this.

You need to understand a lot of this is a phase kids can go through. He is a pretty good kid right? Then he's going to have to learn to manage this himself with the help of his teacher in the classroom. He's also going to have to find a way to do what he needs to do.

He's old enough to get ready for bed on his own. Stop managing him. If he doesn't brush his teeth it's really not a big deal, seriously. Brushing teeth has very little to do with anything other than bad breath. Either they have good enamel and very little risk of cavities or weak enamel and they'll have cavities no matter how much they brush or floss. Let it go and see what happens. He is old enough to know it's bedtime and what he's supposed to do when he gets ready for bed.