How to Resolve Repeating Problem in Marriage

honesty is so very important to me. like you, i'd have a much harder time with that than with anything else.
i think counseling would be well worth the investment and expense if you go into it with a fairly narrow focus. you don't have huge overwhelming broad-spectrum problems, what you need is simply to have more tools as to how to communicate in an open, non-threatening manner. he needs to feel safe enough to tell you his plans without worrying that you're going to withdraw, and you need to be able to trust in what he tells you.
good luck!
khairete
S.

Because I do not know the 2 of you, but I have been married for over 30 years and know a lot of other couples. Some that are still together and a few that are divorced.. Here is my take on this situation..

Being a parent is pretty all consuming. Being a M. IS all consuming for most moms.

For Dads, because they have such a strong partner, who always seems to do the parenting, "the right way" , it is way easier for them to pull themselves away from family time earlier than it will for us moms. Yes, they love their families as much as we moms do, but many times, because they are not the main caregiver, they begin to feel like they can be away a bit more.

Men cannot read our minds. They do not take hints. They cannot take or understand subtle.

You want or need something, you just have to be truthful and blunt.

Questions for you to answer honestly to yourself.

What exactly do you want to do?
What do you want?
What do you need?
What is YOUR passion?
Where do you find your fun?
What would you like to do that you are not able to do at this point?

What do you exactly want him to do?
What exactly do you need from him?

What is the absolute truth?

Do you keep your words that when he is honest you do not get mad, you do not sulk.. you do not hold it against him later?
Every time?
Some of the time, hardly any time?

Do you want to go to every performance?
Do you want to go to every other performance?
Once a month?
Do you want him to tell you what time he will be home?
Do you want him to call when he is on his way home?
Do you want him to quit till the kids are older?
Do you want him to bring home more money?
Do you want him to give you the money he makes to pay for a sitter?
Do you want the money to go towards the bills?

You need to be honest with yourself about what you can handle.
Then you need to be honest with him.. And then keep your word.

No seething, no pouting.. When you realize maybe you are still getting upset or whatever, let him know. "I thought this is what I wanted/needed, but I am realizing, I am still upset/frustrated, mad.". whatever. At least then you will both know what you are dealing with.

I think it is good for couples to have their own interests sometimes.
If you want to go to his gigs make it happen. Get a sitter, take the kids..

If you want to go out with your friends.. organize it. But be sure to give him the heads up, what his part will be..

When he gives you a schedule and you want or need him home to do family stuff.. tell him and post it on the calendar and work together to find a solution.

We went to Marriage counseling a long time ago. It saved or marriage. it was hard to be so honest about our raw feelings. But at least we learned to say
"This is what I need."
"This is what I need from you."
"I am having a hard time dealing with this."
"These words make me mad because"
"I am sorry"
"I misunderstood what that meant".
"I need you to explain what you just said"

I am not sure but my guess is you both are between 25 &30. It's time for him to grow up. I roadie for a band so I know a lot of musicians they can still go out and perform and hold down a regular job and be a husband and father. It is a CHOICE they make when they decide to get married. They do not cheat on their wives, or flake out on their kids or lie. They play music because it is their passion but even at full time playing they don't earn enough to support a family. One of my musician friends worked as a mortage broker, a talent agent, had a solo show and played in a 3 piece band. He worked a lot and he was in his 50's when he did this. He also had a live-in girlfriend and she had 3 daughters. He encouraged her to go back to school and helped the girls with their homework, did his yardwork and always picked-up and helped cleaned the house. One of the other guys played for his church every Sunday, took care of his home and worked as a computer consultant all over the U.S. and played in the band. The third member had a wife and 2 kids and drove a charter bus and taught music and played in the band. These men do not run around on their wives.

Your husband is an emotional abuser. He lies to you and hides what he does. Until you make him decide to either be a good husband and father and a musician or a musician who gets to play around whenever he wants, nothing will change. Counseling is not going to change him until he grows up.

I'm sorry if this sounds harsh but he's still a little boy pretending to be a man. My advice to you is to find a domestic violence shelter and get some counseling through them.

He likes being a dad, but he doesn't like being married. Sorry if that's blunt, but it's true. When you are married, you are supposed to ACT like you're married.

I know you love your 3 kids you made with this man, but I have to wonder why you put up with this even before the kids came along. Having kids doesn't make this kind of guy "man up". Yet you continued to have kids with him.

I doubt seriously that you will get what you want with him, ever. He does not care one wit that he lies to you because he wants what he wants and he'll lie in order to get to do it. Rather than seeing you as his wife and his equal, he sees you as "mommy" telling him what to do, so he sneaks around and fights with you. Then he makes up so that he can have sex and you'll keep cleaning his house and making life easy for him to do what HE wants.

Either you will just have to live with his deceit, or you will decide you've had enough and you'll leave him. The decision will be up to you.

Sorry.
Dawn

It is hard to be a boy having fun and then suddenly a grown up. My Dad told my when I was younger, that men don't mature until they are grown men, and that even HE, was not fully mature yet. He was 35 at the time.

I agree with finding some help. He wants to go play, and in turn it is turning you into a bitter nag (not that this is what you are, but it is what he thinks) and while he grows younger you grow older with disdain and unprovided needs. It will change you in ways that for most women are irreversible. And ultimately cause him to stay away longer.

If you have a joint account, you need to build a separate one of your own. This account will serve as the 'you' account. To which you will use once or twice a week, to do what ever makes you happy. As of right now, it sounds like you have entered that mother child relationship with your partner. You say no, he fears to ask, he sneaks out, you put him on punishment; no sex, no cuddling, no friendship, etc. And then time heals all...and you are back at it like nothing happened. Letting him know that if he waits you out, things will pass, and when he wants he can push again.

This will be hard to wrap your head around, because you want him to be there, and be the man he promised you he would be. It is NOT wrong to want that. But you have to understand that when you bicker about him doing something, you make him feel like a child, which makes him feel less like a man, which makes him act out. And it leaves you holding the ball. His buddies call him whipped. So he is 'showing you' by doing what he wants anyways. What he is missing, is that many women would have replaced him by now, with a man who would never leave his wife and children to go play. He is taking advantage of the fact that you will be there. In addition to the silly notion some men have, that women won't leave them, because we have their children. Ha ha. It is 2013, plenty of men love women, who come already equipped with what others work toward. He should be mindful of that. But I digress.

If you want someone to trust you with their secrets you listen. If you want someone who doesn't feel like they have secrets with you, you let go, allowing them the trust and chance to come to you.

When he leaves, tell him to have fun. Right now he knows exactly where you are, and what you are doing. If he was out doing his thing, and you were out doing yours, eventually he will start to bother with the fact that his wife is being seen. He will not like that. When he comes back, ask him if he had fun, what he did, to engage in a conversation. If he does not answer, or skirts around simply say, well sounds interesting, hope it was a good time. And leave it at that. If there is a time you feel he should not leave because you need him there, tell him that. Don't yell about what he needs to do. He is a man, tell him ' I need you' if he still leaves, let him know that his choice may not be the best, but you understand, and let him go.

This will allow him the chance to share. He will notice at some point that you have taken up doing your own thing. As you get time to yourself that every mother need! you will become more relaxed, and in turn you will become much closer to your children as you will have really let the mess go, and they will feel that. He will see that. He will come home to a relaxed wife, who seems to be okay with him being gone, and has the house in order without him. He will then make a choice.

No man wants to come home to a home that works without him there. The sad part to this is that I know what this sounds like, but I do not know your husband so I will not speculate. What I do know is that spending tons of money on a stranger drawing out sessions to tell you that you need to stop busting his chops, and that he needs to be a man, is not what you need.
(pardon my harshness) and you don't need any bitter women telling you that he is wrong and you are right, girl power. Because the reality is we all play a role in our unhappiness. If you want him to be there, you have to create an environment that he wants to be in. You know how to mold a man, so do it. The wiliest creature is a woman. We know how to get what we want. You want him home? show him a home worth coming to. And yes it is realistic. He is not a kid anymore, unless he is about to be the next biggest something. He should be focused on being his babies superstar, and his wife's.

If in the end, and you have tried, he is still going out and leaving you to do the work alone. Than he will be taking advantage of your niceness, and THIS is when you make a choice. Right now it is a matter of him not being happy at home, it is why he is always gone. There could be other issues as well that you should start to entertain; gambling, women....I am saying that even a bad husband doesn't need to lie because he wants to go play. So perhaps in your pursuit to YOUR happiness, you start looking in to why his isn't where it should be.

I tried to hit angles that may have been missed to help in my answer, I know it is hard to type a lifetime in a paragraph. So I hope I hit it for you. And I hope you take my advise, and find sometime for you. It is important not to wait around for life to happen to you.

Best wishes.

It looks pretty clear to me. He is allowed to live his life, kind of do what he wants to, while you take care of the family. If you have had counseling, and he insists on staying the same (having fun, doing what he wants to) then you have some choices to make. If you want to have fun then do it. Find babysitters and get together with friends. If you want to follow your own passion, then do it, again it will involve finding babysitters and you will have to do what makes you happy, either basket weaving or being a rock star or whatever. When you married was he in a band or is he following a long lost dream?If you didn't sign up for this life and find this is all a surprise then I would think hard and seriously if this is what you want forever because it might not change unless his band goes defunct. You both signed up to be parents obviously so tell him while his band is a great act he might want to get his act together with you or you will take it on the road.

Cost/time is an issue? Well, cost can get fixed: You find a counselor with a sliding scale fee or you find one through your county or city government's mental health clinics or a local women's center, or you give up something, somehow, to pay for counseling instead. Time is an issue? With three young kids I"m sure time's tough to find but if you and he don't find it now -- you will both need to find a lot of time and money to get divorce lawyers.

Why are you married to an immature boy who lies to you?

Why are you in this cycle that sounds more like teenagers than adults with children and responsibilities? Kiss and make up? That's for kids, not grown-ups. Grown-ups talk to each other, tell the truth, and don't fear their spouse's reactions. Grown-ups don't go out with the band when they need to be at home with the family. Grown-ups DO go out with the band when their spouses are cool with it and it makes everyone, not just daddy, happy.

Get counseling or get a lawyer. Present it to him that way. You want to improve your communication and that is great. But you are both way past doing it on your own or with advice from an Internet forum. See a professional. He needs a third party, not you (and not us) to tell him that the lies have to stop or you can't trust him, and if you can't trust him-- do you want to live that way?

You hit it right on the head. You're in a cycle. In order to break the cycle, one (or preferably both) of you needs to do something different. The hard part, though, is to keep in mind that the ONLY behavior you can control is your own. You can't force him to do anything, but you can change the way that you approach/respond to him.

Why do you think he's lying to you? Seriously. I would start right there because that is the most damaging thing going on. Every behavior serves a function. Find out the function of this behavior for him and then work to find another way to achieve the same outcome.

Does he lie to you because he's hiding something that is going to cause a divorce or is he lying to you because you resent his lifestyle and he doesn't want to hear about it? Two totally different "reasons" for the same behavior. What is it in YOUR behavior (the reaction he gets) that is discouraging him from telling you the truth? The only way to know is to ask him.

Find an evening that isn't busy and when you are not angry with one another and ask him calmly and in a non-accusatory way why he is hiding things from you. Let him know how it makes you feel when you discover things afterward. Don't whine. Don't accuse him of things. Most importantly, listen to what he's saying.

I'm a psychologist, but sometimes I lose perspective in my own life. Several years ago my husband and I got into a massive fight. It lasted DAYS, no exaggeration. He exploded on me for something that I had done literally 100 times before and I was completely blindsided.

So... after two days of not speaking, I finally asked him why it bothered him on that day, but not on the days before. It was a sincere question asked in a calm and sincere way. His response was that it always bothered him, but he let it go day-to-day but his frustration was building and it just exploded. We talked about the fact that I cannot read his mind and if something is bothering him, he needs to tell me then so that I don't keep doing it... thus building frustration.... resulting in a fight.

We have had similar conversations over the years and they have turned into "conversations" not fights. We both had to change our behavior to make that happen, but his method of "ignore until I explode" and my mindset of "everything is OK unless he says otherwise" was resulting in lots of built up anger. Now we don't let that happen. It's a conscious choice built out of maturity and dedication to our family.

Talk with him because this pattern of resentment and dishonesty will result in a broken home. There is no "maybe" there.

Have you ever read 'The Dance of Intimacy'? Or, 'The Games People Play.' Cheaper than counseling, but of course, it takes two. May help with the pattern you find yourself in.

Frankly, it seems pretty clear...

He doesn't see it as a problem... he continues to lie, until you get really mad, then you kiss and make up... and he may be "good" for a little bit, until he decides to do what HE wants to do...

This is the behavior of a child, not a grown man.

He is not willing to change......

So... you have some decisions to make... do you want to keep putting up with it, or do you want to get on with your life?

All you can do is control how YOU react or behave... you can't control his behavior... and until HE is willing to change, he isn't going to change.

Going back to counseling is a good idea. Will he go? It sounds like he needs to confront his lying !!!

Tell him the truth...That this cycle is making you upset and that you'd like some more help around the house, date nights and for him to stop lying.

In the meantime, tell him that you'd like him to put a dinner together a few nights a week. I am guessing that his band plays on weekends. If so, ask him if he could make dinner on Tuesdays and Thursdays.

On Wednesdays---Go out w/ one of your friends or take an hr long excercise class. He goes out !! You should, too !!! He can watch the kids and put them to bed that night !

Then, see if a family member or sitter could watch the kids every other Saturday night. This way you could see his band. If he is not playing, then, you could have a date night.

It sounds to me like you need some more help around the house and you need some more alone/ date time.

You can't change him to be what you want. You can only change yourself or your response to him. He is who he is. Are you ok with what he is now or not?
The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result. This is what you're doing. He doesn't sound like he wants to change. This situation is working for him, its you that has the problem with it. If he's willing and committed to changing himself to be what you need and deserve that's great. If no, you need to re-evaluate your own needs/wants.

My father was/is in a band, and was always pulling this kind of stuff. I grew up to resent it and felt like my father didn't love me as much as his band. So not only will this drive a wedge between you and he, all this drama will hurt your kids. I wish I had the answer for you. If he doesn't see it now, I don't know that he will. Some people just never grow up. BTW- It didn't end up well for my father and I. We have no relationship. He missed my wedding to play at a gig 1/2 mile from the church where I was married. I hope this kind of abandonment doesn't happen to your kids.

You need to develop your own outside activities/hobbies. He can stay home with the kids on his nights off and you can go out and enjoy life again.

You are sitting home waiting on him so he has lost interest in you, sort of....that doesn't sound nice I know but maybe you know what I'm trying to say. When he met you you were working? Had friends? interests that didn't include him? You were your own person, now you're just someone who lives at his house and takes care of his kids and warms his bed....right?

So to make yourself more interesting again you need to be the person he fell in love with, within reason of course. He sees no one showing any interest in you as a person so there's no danger of someone else wanting you. You sit at home and hassle him to spend more time with you, so he stays away and doesn't want to spend time with you.

Getting you AWAY from his interests and having a life of your own gives you new facets and depth. His interest should pick up again and he should start asking you to join him.

Sadly, if he doesn't then he's most likely leading a double life an many people he comes in contact with may not even know you exist.

Having his own time and "thing" is fine.
To me? Lying is not fine.
So agree that he gets to A, B, C then let it happen. No whining about it, guilting about it etc.
Of course, this works both ways. You should get time for your "thing" too!

First of all, good fathers don't lie to the mothers of their children. Second, if his lips are moving, he's lying is more than an assumption-it's a fact. Third, stop caring. Fourth, start hiring help with the housework, bills and children-that should straighten out a few things.

Counseling - far too many issues and your not stuck trying to work it out yourselves. I 'read' your life has changed a lot with kids and your husband's hasn't. I would feel very disappointed that my husband made me feel he valued his social life and what he wants to be doing over spending time with his wife and kids.
Lying is a huge red flag. That alone is worth counseling. It makes you feel like a fool.
I didn't read that you need more time to yourself so adding your own hobbies outside the house wouldn't help in it could just result in even less time together and a tit for tat log of time out of the house.
Keep making calls until you find a counseling service that is income tested and affordable. Contact churches, local counsel etc for leads.
This sounds like a problem that can be fixed but someone other than you needs to question your husband. Your just the 'M. figure enforcing his curfew'.
Stand your ground. As kids age life gets busier in lots of ways. You need his commitment.
good luck - don't forget to your needs are important too

It sounds like you ever poo or get off the pot. He isn't there taking care of the kids and you are stuck with everything.

You can do it together as you have or you can do it all alone without him. How many aspirins can you take to get rid of a headache as you keep beating your head on a wall? Soon it will crack and then what?

Go back to counseling on your own and find out what you want to do and then just do it. Living like you are you will be 65 and in the same boat with nothing. Life goes on and the only way it changes is when you do. As the saying goes time and tide wait for no one.

Make yourself happy first and then work on moving on. Life is too short for this kind of drama.

Good luck to you.

the other S.

PS Him telling me all these stories and NOT wanting me with him would have been a deal breaker.

I would do whatever was necessary to get back into counseling. If he won't go, you can go yourself and discuss the issues you are having, and the therapist may be able to give you advice on how to discuss this more productively with your husband. Usually, somewhere in there, there's a way to compromise - you could get some outside interests of your own, and he could agree to cut back. You can learn to communicate in a way that hopefully won't make him feel defensive. But if he really wants to make his marriage a priority, he needs to stop lying, because that is eroding your trust in him. And when you both withdraw, won't talk to each other, and "stonewall", nothing gets resolved. Hopefully a good marriage counselor will be able to help you with these issues, but you both have to be willing to make the changes that he/she suggests. If your husband is not willing to put your marriage and the kids first, then perhaps he is too immature yet to be willing to make some of the sacrifices that having a family requires.

Lying is a coward's way. Children lie. He has been told more than once by different people that it is manipulative and not acceptable. You are bound to repeat this pattern until he changes. I don't see that happening.

You could do what some people have one to kids that lie. Lie to him.
Tell him you have to go to a parent teacher conference. Go out with your friends. Call him in the middle of it and let him know you are out. See how hurt it makes him.

I normall don't recommend that you lie to a spouse. I HATE lying. But it might cure him.

It's super hard when you can't get your husband to listen to you about things that matter a lot to you. I know.

The only thing I can think of is to address this when you are getting along well, not when you're not getting along. Nothing will get through then. Tell him you believe he deserves time to himself, and so do you, but ask him to come to an agreement about how much time each week is reasonable for each parent. Usually when you have little kids there isn't much more time than a few hours each week for parents to have alone time. Once they are teens, your world opens up a lot. Hopefully he will agree to a reasonable amount of "me time" and then stick to it.

If he won't do it, I don't know the answer. You don't sound unreasonable. This kind of not listening is one of the reasons I'm not thrilled with males these days.

You’re in a tough spot so if you can and his willing go to counseling. I was in a similar situation as yours, except instead of a band, it was booze. We hardly ever did anything together as a family or as a couple, unless there was alcohol somehow involved, and he never invited me to any recreational activity with his friends or wanted to join me with my friends. I was basically a single mother with a roommate who didn’t even pay his share of the bills.
We talked about it many times and each time he would say it’s just the way it is…until I decided it was not for me anymore and after 15 yrs of marriage, we separated and are working towards the divorce. We now get along great because I don’t resent his absences and him been drunk almost every time I saw him and when he comes over, he actually spends time with the kids.
It lasted so long because he’s a good man, in spite of his drinking he was never abusive or violent, because of the kids and because I didn’t want to be a divorced woman. I tried the I can’t change him so I’ll change me approach, but it was taking its toll on me by feeling that I was been taken advantage of and feeling very unappreciated.
I’m not telling you to divorce, what I’m trying to say is that if you don’t solve the problem somehow, with help from a counselor or some other way, the resentment will grow and grow until you may find divorce to be your only option.
Good luck to you, I truly hope you find the answer that works for you.

I know how this feels. You sound like you really love him. So it's a surprise every time he lies because you thought you dealt with it already. Your thinking how could he make me feel so left out AGAIN. Why aren't you included and that hurts. If he is lying about going out and hanging out with friends he is lying about a lot of stuff. You just have not caught him yet. I know from being married to my first husband how all this feels. Being a at home M. doing everything at home is a lot of work. And he is out having fun not thinking you might want to join in. I will let you know it gets old. Being alone with kids all the time will get to you eventually.
If he is not putting his 100% into you and the kids now, he is not going to. So you either have to take him like he is or change how you want to live. Counselling sounds like a good idea. Good luck!

What about a written schedule?

You talk about what you each have going on and coming up, write it on the schedule/calendar?? That way you know what's coming up, and you can make sure there is enough family time and 'us' time scheduled in and that everything is talked about before hand??

The lying would drive me batty...I just couldn't do it with him!!! Maybe this will take away his need to lie??

Sorry, that's all I got?!

Communication and honesty are essential in a marriage. If he's not going to be honest and he's not going to tell you what's up with him, then I don't see how you're going to resolve this unless you just resign yourself to this is how it is and ignore it going forward.

I definitely understand the hurt you feel when you learn things in a round about way or when he doesn't ever invite you to do these outside acitivies with him. It does make you feel excluded and alone.