Feeling Hopeless

I can't tell you how not to do this-just that it is really good that you know how much of a problem it is and are trying to fix it. I did this with my older son-laid there with him until he fell asleep. He is now 9 and he has the worst time ever falling asleep. He really still needs someone with him. And when he wakes in the middle of the night he still comes in. Wish like anything that I would have nipped it in the bud at 3. Good luck to you.

Read "healthy sleep habits, happy child" by mark weisbluth, MD

A quick read and a lot of ideas. Good luck

Stop going in there after putting her down. Stick to your routine, but when it's time for bed she goes to bed. Period. If she calls for you, don't respond. If she gets out of bed and comes to your room, don't interact with her. Simply turn her around and get her back to her bed.

She yells for you b/c she knows you will come to her. Without getting too much into behavioral theory, the behavior will continue as long as it serves a function. When the function (you coming to her room) stops, so will the behavior.

L., I wrote this post:

Not Just Another Sleep Problem....Saw this tip on AFV
Dear Mamas with all the toddler sleep issues/disturbances/lack of sleep/inability to stay asleep.....

I sometimes swear I'll quit this site of I read another help question for getting their kid to sleep more or longer or better....It is truly an ongoing battle at every age and is clearly of huge concern for almost all families. I personally have still not outgrown my inability to sleep the night away.....anyway, I digress...

We were watching AFV (America's Funniest Home Videos) tonight and this young dad had the same problem as many of us, their child would scream, and cry and just throw the biggest tantrum when he was placed into his crib for nighty-night. His wife was away and he recalled that his toddler son did not have this problem with other adults. So he simply donned an old Halloween wig, changed up his voice, entered his son's room ...and I was just shocked, the boy laid right down and went to bed. Scared no doubt, but it was amazing to see the complete turn around and compliance of the child.

I'd be curious if any mom's here have tried this fake identity trick?

If not, do you think you would?

Good morning L., I have read about this problem in many post, I don't understand children having this much control over a parent, L. you said your self this is affecting your relationship with your husband. Our first born son tried this at 2, 2 1/2 and my husband nipped it in the bud right away. We have a very loving very soothing bedtime routine, but at night he started coming in our room, he wasn't sick, he didn't have bed dreams, so my husband told him after tucking him back in, that if he does not stay in his bed then he was going to get a swat, Yes mom's a swat. He knew he could get up to go potty, he knew he could get up if he didn't feel good, or had a bad dream, so the next time he did it my husband took him back to his room gave him 2 good swats tucked him in and problem was solved, all it took was for him to understand he was not in charge, he was not going to manipulate. L. you are giving your daughter what she wants when she displays bad behavior, she screams and cries cause it works, she does not need you to sit with her to fall a sleep, it whats she wants and her creaming manipulates you to do it. Kate if you are reading this, same thing for you sweetie, kids were never met to be in charge, that's our job, it's not our job to obey our children and be manipulated by them, it's are job to teach, train and yes moms discipline them, there are way to many children/toddlers controlling their parents sleep. Don't get depressed get firm, step back and let your husband take charge if you feel you can. Read Susans post, and see how she was controlled by her child, she gave up, her child won that battle, she say sometimes she was able to crawl back to her bed, ABLE? who's the parent? I'm floored at hat i am reading. Somer did it right. Hope this helps J.

maybe start enforcing some kind of punishment? i did that with my daughter, she'd wake up just to see me, and say like wanting a drink of water, etc...after a night or two, i would just sternly tell her no, go back to sleep, then walk away, no hugs, no kisses...she'll keep it up as long as you keep giving her what she wants...and now that the cycle has begun, it'll be hard to break it

just in case my post is read again, i've been reading on some posts here and omg....MOM'S grow a back bone with your kids, i agree 100% with Julie, there is nothing wrong with showing that you can be a "mean/firm" mom quit letting your kids run your household and set the rules for them. yes it's hard to do that, but there's nothing wrong with a firm hand from mom, i don't know how some of you get through the HOUR let alone the night...

Hi L.,

I remember as a child how my mother used to take the stroller in the house at night to get me to sleep. She would stroll back and forth in our living room with tears would rolling down her face because she couldn't get me to sleep. When I had children of my own, I promised myself that I would NEVER do what she did to get my kids to sleep. It is the parent that teaches their child to be dependent on the parent to get the child to sleep, which is a no-no. You need to retrain your daughter and take back your control. Every time she gets out of bed, do not say anything, but walk her back. If she cries, let her cry. After a few nights or maybe even a few weeks depending on how stubborn she is, she will get the message.

I would say it's going to get worse before it gets better.
Put a baby gate on her door.
Put some pillows & blankets on her floor.
Don't respond after you do a quick check....just say "sleep" or "time for bed" and leave. Check/reassure her every 5 mins, then 10 mins, etc (if she's crying).
It's tough but, like Band Aid removal, it will be best over quickly (3-4 nights).

You are not alone. My 2.5 year old started that too. We were the sweet parents to begin with, but then realized that that wasn't helping and had to put our foot (feet) down. We now say goodnight (whatever routine we have) and then close the door. No response to the calling out, no "cover me". It is just their way of getting you back in. We got a My Tot Clock, so that if we have to go in for potty, we can say the clock is blue, what does blue mean? Sleep. That's right, so what do you need to do? Sleep.

He will still call out a little, but it has drastically improved. The key is consistency. Two nights ago, he was calling out and my husband opened the door and told him that we asked him to sleep and he will wake up sister. I soooo didn't want him to do that, as last night, the calling out was intensified.

We do go in if he is really crying, but most of the time we can tell it is the yelling, not crying.

Hello L.,
My heart goes out to you. It can be solved though - in a short period time and your little person could become a good sleeper - for life. You don't have to live this way - and one of teh biggest myths out there - is that it is a phase and she will just grow out of it. Sleep is actually a skill - at some point in your life - you learned how to fall asleep all on your own - to go from point A being awake to point B being asleep. Your husband learned it too, and your daughter can.
I can completely relate - I too suffered from sleep deprivation with my first child. I only lasted 4 and 1/2 months though. I felt that having Max was the worst mistake I had ever made in my life. I was depressed,angry and felt a lot of resentment toward my child and my spouse. Like you, I turned to teh internet for advice, books and doctors. Nothing helped until I hired a sleep consultant and then everything changed. I went from being a depressed and unhappy Mom to a very happy one with a child who NEVER slept to one that would peacefully go to sleep every night around 7 and not wake up until 6:30 or so the next morning. Naps also became a dream come true.
It made such a profound impact on me that I hired her again for my newborn and then I decided to become a sleep consultant myself.

It's never to late to give your daughter the beautiful gift and skill of sleep.
I get Mamapedia to reach out to Moms like you to let them know that there is professional help out there.
For some free advice, you can visit my website. Look for the 5 easy steps. It is more tailored around babies, but I do help for children from newborns up to age 8. I will be honest though - 2 and 1/2 can be a tough age group to work with - I am not sure if the free advice will be sufficient to solve your problems.
I look forward to hearing from you.
P.
www.sleepsense.net/kelowna
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My son did the same thing when he moved out of his crib at 2, except he would stay awake for like an hour and a half and we would have to lay beside him the whole time! We slowly moved away, so a few days into it I would sit a couple of feet away, and then a few days later I was in the doorway where he could see me, and then I moved to farther out where he couldn't see me. My son was really scared at the beginning, but as we moved farther away at night, he got over it. We also talked to him about why he was scared (monsters, I explained they weren't real), and that really helped. When he would wake up during the night, he would come screaming into our room, we would go back in and stay with him for a little bit, and then sneak out, but he hasn't woken in the middle of the night in a week or so (when he does get up in the morning, there is no more screaming). It took about three weeks to get him to a good spot, but we did it slow enough that he could get used to it (without a lot of tears), and that helped. We also now play music when he goes to bed, and sing the ABCs and Old MacDonald every night, so we set up a completely new bedtime ritual while doing this, but it works for all of us.

Hi L.,

1st...... there is a light at the end of the tunnel!!! It will get better. You've gotten lots of advice but, I can just tell you what worked for me. My oldest daughter NEVER slept! I thought I was going to go insane. I read books went to sleep consultants blah blah blah. I really never felt comfortable letting her CIO or not being there for her when I truly felt she was scared. One book that I found helpful was The No Cry Sleep Solution. But, you're probably too tired to read it. When my daughter hit 21/2 she had just come off of a long run of sleeping through the entire night but, then she started to freak out and jump out of her crib so we moved her to a bed. I had to lie down with her while she fell asleep for months and if she woke up during the night, I just let her sleep with us. But, eventually she started sleeping all night by herself and when she got a twin bed I told her it was too small and I couldn't lie down with her anymore. Also I started sticker charts where, if she slept all night she would earn a certain amount of stickers and if she filled the whole chart she would win a fabulous prize. That worked really well. The bottom line for me was not making too big a deal about it and realizing that it would pass. Eventually she won't want to even give me a kiss good night so I've learned to try to appreciate these needy moments even though it seems frustrating. Just know that whatever you decide to do is ok and YES you will sleep again. Good luck. I hope you get some sleep tonight :)

She is big enough that you can have a conversation with her. You need to find something that will be a motivating factor for her to NOT call you in the middle of the night. Sticker charts leading up to a toy, pancakes for breakfast, what the heck, even candy for breakfast! Just tell her that she is a big girl, and big girls do not wake up mommy in the middle of the night. Then say every morning that she does not wake up mommy, she gets to have XXX. Brainstorm with her what she can do when she does wake up, maybe she needs 3, 4, 10 blankets laying around her bed so that she can cover herself, a nightlight, etc. just let her know that she probably will wake up, but calling mommy is NOT an option, and she needs to come up with some ideas that she can do for herself to help her go back to sleep. Then BIG rewards will follow in the morning. Good luck!

This book was a godsend: "The No-cry Sleep Solution" by E. Pantley. Don't give into the CIO crowd; it's totally unnecessary. And the thought of punishing her as some have said is just sad. This book totally worked for us (and yes, we had problems with sleep before that).

So much good luck to you.

I don't have the perfect answer since i had a child who never slept well either. (my second child was a great sleeper - thankfully!!!)

I took all kinds of well meaning advice and tried it all - the cry thru the night appraoch, etc. I was working full time at that point and felt high constantly from lack of sleep. Finally in desperation I just gave up. I got her a single bed, put the box spring on the floor so the bed was low and just climbed in to bed with her. I always crawled back to my bed at some point, and sometimes was able to stay in my own bed the rest of the night and sometimes wasn't. Obviously it's not the best answer - but I just reached the end of my sleep-deprived rope. ;o)

There were times I was so tired that I'd wake up and find her in bed next to me - again - not the best answer - but you gotta to do what you gotta do...

The only real suggestions I can make is - make sure she's getting lots of fresh air and exercise, try bedtime rituals - we used to read together while both sitting in her bed - many times she'd fall asleep while we read. Maybe it's time to cut back or eliminate the naps, etc.

Best of luck! I just wish these kids all knew how to sleep well!

i always say that lack of sleep leads to depression..i was there..boy was i there..my son is now 4..at night i let him stay up with us..he plays on the computer..reads books..tonight we were exercising and he was joining in then he started to just watch..i let him fall asleep on the couch..then we carry him to his bed..he usually wakes around 6 am and comes and sleeps with us kicking and flailing his arms..I was a single mom and we now have my boyfriend living with us..
at 2.5 i had my son sleeping in my bed and i had a body pillow between us so i wouldn't get kicked all night..then when my boyfriend moved in we had to move him to his own room but luckily i have a bedroom that has a room adjoining ...so he sleeps close..
but when he was 3 i tried to have him sleep on his own and i put a lock on his door for a week and did CIO in the mornings..and any wake up times ..i had to ..he was waking at 4am for the day and i was out of it..i was afraid to drive b/c i was so tired.
i would have her CIO..put a lock on the outside of the door for one week..i know its not the best idea but it works..a mom told me to do that when she saw how tired i was...it worked but then i would worry all night about him and still couldn't sleep..
so back to my room he went..
but now things are better since we let him fall asleep with us on the couch..or i let him watch a little movie on his mini dvd player and the he falls asleep watching that..sometimes he sleeps through the night til 9am ..other nights he comes in at 6am..
things do get better...he will let me sleep in sometimes ..i make him breakfast and turn on some cartoons and he'll watch for an hour and i'll snooze..so hang in there..
if you need a good drink suggestion that will give you energy..look into Pumped N.O. ..you can find them at the Vitamin Shop by a company called ABB..its a workout drink..i workout a lot but i also just drink it when i'm sluggish..

good luck..

xo

D.

wow, this is just like the question I just posted! I have no suggestion, as I am to the point of losing my mind with my two year old's sleeping issues! Good luck! And know I'm out here suffering with ya!