38 Year Old Brother Living with Us

I'd not allow a kid to be rude to an adult no matter what. That's just not nice.

I'd say something to him the moment he says something about Jewish people because he needs to know it's not okay with you.

If his child support is so much of his pay then it's set too high. It's only supposed to be about 13.5% of his income. So he should have plenty to live on. That's questionable. If he's not making the same income he was in the past he needs to have a hearing to get it lowered to the minimum amount he should be paying.

He should make his income, pay about 15% in taxes before he gets paid, then about 13.5% for child support. So that leaves over 50% of his income for bills. If he can't make it on his own he needs to have a room mate.

It's not your job to raise your brother.
It is your job to raise your 14 yr old.
I think some distance between your child and your brother is a good idea.

My mom always says houseguests (including or especially relatives) are like fish. Both go bad after 3 days.

You are annoyed having a free loader. Everything he does will be wrong.

You and your dad are playing games too. "Free loader likes me better than you!" "Oh yeah, he said he likes me better and would rather live with me." "Oh, yeah, well he is living with me." "Well he said your your daughter is an annoying brat."

Stop over analyzing and take care of your daughter and husband first. Your brother will talk sh^& about you until your parents and brother get on each others nerves and then he will say mean things about them. He will call you and say "Dad yelled at me for sleeping until 9:30am" Now the circle will start again.

I see you used the term, "Many enablers here."

So stop being an enabler. And you're not just enabling your brother -- you are allowing your dad to walk all over you too and make you feel bad.

You're far, FAR too invested in wondering and worrying about whether dad and mom are mad at you. While it's nice that your family is close, nice that you appreciate your blessings, etc., it's time for nice to take a vacation and for you to be the tough adult here.

Set a departure date for brother. He goes to dad's, he goes wherever, but he goes. Smile and smile as you do it, but stick to it. I think from your post that you might be tempted to cave in to keep everyone else happy, but if you do--you are putting your daughter at risk. She does not need him in the household. You are putting him ahead of your own child and that is simply the wrong way around. Yes, she has been rude but it's because HE has been totally inappropriate: No adult should dump their issues onto a young teen like that; no adult should give a kid the silent treatment; he is too close to her and sees her as a sounding board when any real adult would know that it's not right to do so.

Don't bother to tell him all this or try to have a nice "heart to heart" talk. He sounds far too immature to understand. Your communications with your father about your brother sound extremely poor and unclear, and you need to be very direct with both dad and brother: "We need you to move out on Date X, bro. Dad, bro is moving out on Date X. I am not sure if he's moving in with you or not because you tell me one thing and he tells me another, but the two of you have to work that out - I will not get involved. Bro you have two weeks to make other arrangements. I highly recommend you get some legal help because your child support payments should be reduced if you are not working, but you have to take care of that -- I will not get involved. I am not 'throwing you out' but telling you that as of Date X your things will be put in your car because with our health issues and your issues with our child, we need our space back."

Do not discuss, do not engage, do not give further reasons or let him move the departure date, do not let him be with your kid alone anywhere anytime as he will badmouth you to her. If you can give him days and not weeks to leave, even better.

You are a people-pleaser, I think, and while that is usually lovely, now is not the time to be a people-pleaser. Your child is going to see that you tolerate being walked over and lied to. Do you want that to continue? She is already learning contempt for uncle and probably granddad too. She will learn contempt for you and your husband if you allow your brother to stay.

I think you need to examine why you are so co-dependent and dysfunctional with your brother. I would not for 2 seconds tolerate a sibling causing my child to feel disrespected in my home. Never. Your obligation is to your darling child not to a brother who is failing at life. You asked and I would tell you if you were my friend, he needs to move along. I really feel sad for your daughter. What a horrible situation to foist upon her. Maybe you need to discuss this with a therapist so you see how unhealthy this situation is for YOUR family.

Your brother is incredibly immature. He's insecure. He is not very motivated. He is holding a grudge with a child. He needs people to stop enabling him...he needs to grow up, work full time, and in the evenings work towards a degree. Or work two jobs if necessary. He needs to live on his own or with his peers...not with family members. He needs therapy. Big time! It is a really good idea that he is moving out. I'm sorry your parents side with him...that sucks. But the good side is he is moving out and you can get on with life without him there! The rest will probably blow over.

The bottom line is nobody gets to tell you what grown people live in your home other than DH, but even then you're the adult paying the bills. It sounds like your brother is unhealthy and your daughter is being exposed to this unhealthy situation. I would give your brother a timeframe of YOUR choosing to find a new place to live vs letting him do whatever indefinitely. Have some tough love. If he cannot stay with you, perhaps he can stay with your parents. If he's been living with you for 6 months, that's long enough. Whether or not your parents approve, it's your home. Maybe they are offended, and maybe they aren't. Have you spoken to them directly? Sometimes we forget to speak up for our own needs for fear of "offending"....when you just need to be assertive.

Worry less about brother. Worry more about your 14 yr old. She's the only "freeloader" who needs to live there.

Your daughter sounds like the most sane person out of all of you! Take her smart lead, and ask yourself why your brother doesn't get a job, take more classes, and find a way to live independently. You will probably realize that it is because you are all making it too easy for him to put his feet up and blame everyone else for his problems.

Preserve your loving relationship with your daughter. Preserve your marriage. Send your brother packing so he can live with your parents, and they can deal with the slacker they raised. You will probably find that you can love your brother and respect yourself more after he moves out.

The only person in this equation who didn't ask to be put in this easily remedied situation is your daughter. It is not fair that she has to share her space with an emotional vampire. Please do your part to help her before she starts to hate you for voluntarily putting her in harm's way. Good luck! Time to start strengthening that spine. You can do it!

added:Why on earth did he quit his job?

Your daughter is the only one with ba11$ enough to give it to him straight. Good for her and good for you for raising such a great kid!

Your brother needs to move on and if he is not able to take care of himself maybe he should just go live with mom and dad and be one big dysfunctional, happy group. (Your dad is probably telling him to stay with you because they don't want him.)

You say you are a close family and I'm sure you don't want things weird between you but this is not good for your daughter. Your brother sounds very immature.

I think it's time to start getting professionals and would be institutions involved with helping you place him somewhere where He- Himself will receive the help that he needs to better resolve the issues that he inwardly has with himself.

I have a brother who has a few issues also and even though he doesn't live with us- were the same pair of proverbial shoes on my feet as well- such is the would be direction that I- personally would tend to take.

Just my thoughts.

If you are an adult living in my house, you will have a job and pay your fair share of expenses and do your fair share of housework or you will GTFO.

Who is writing the Rx for the antidepressants? I hope it is not a PCP (primary care physician/ family practitioner) because he needs more help then a PCP can provide. He has some serious clinical mental health issues that need to be addressed, but not by you. A therapist needs to be involved in his life on a weekly basis.

Pick a date, move him out. Let mom and dad worry about their adult child, and you set some boundaries and stay out of it. You have your own family to take care of.

Does he have VA benefits? THEY can help him find living quarters, a psychiatrist and a therapist.

Stop being the crutch for your family. They are responsible for their feelings and decisions.

Ditto Leigh R. and Lt. mcMurphy

I'm coming at this from a different angle...
Your daughter might be telling the "truth" but she needs to respect her uncle. He's not O. of her 14 year old friends.
She's old enough to know that Uncle Jim is troubled, doesn't work or take classes....she's also old enough to keep her mouth shut about it, right?

After reading all that, I don't even get how you feel. Are you upset with your brother? Do you want him to live with you? I say let him go live with your parents but I'm not sure that's even the question.

Talk to your daughter about how she should address adults, if you believe in that. I do. She shouldn't kiss his butt, but some things are none of her business to mention to him, no matter what he brings to her door. Explain to her that he is in a rough spot and doesn't necessarily get that it's inappropriate to discuss his grown-up issues with her, and encourage her to say as much when he brings it up. This is a lesson for her, too, to learn how to maintain boundaries on her end. (Did your parents ever tell you that certain adults--namely teachers--weren't your friends and should not be spoken to so casually just because they share personal info with you. Children do not always understand where the lines are/should be drawn.)

Tell your brother to CUT. IT. OUT with the inappropriate talk with your daughter. You can't control him, but make sure that he gets the message that it's far from a suggestion.

I agree that he should pay to support his child. I do not agree that it should keep him in the hole and unable to pay even the lowest rent. Maybe he should revisit Family Court to modify his payment amount. If he doesn't have it, then he just doesn't. I'd be depressed, too, if I couldn't bring enough money home to buy a can of soup. It's not always as easy or as simple as just getting a better job and making more money.

Six months is still short term, especially when you're talking about getting his life together, maybe turning some things around. It takes a while to save money when you have pretty much none coming in. That's not long at all.

If you're going to help him, then help him. Don't sit in resentment and judgment of him. Don't let your daughter talk down to him. Teach her that sometimes people need assistance. Teach her to be compassionate about it. Help him strategize and get his finances together. Will he discuss this with you?

Tell your brother--away from your daughter--that you expect him to be an adult and not ignore people in the house when they're talking to him. (Your daughter doesn't need to know what you say to him. They are not equals, so be sure not to send that message, if you want her to treat him like an adult.) Tell your daughter to leave him alone. She's well old enough to understand that not everyone wants to bothered just because she's up for it. Whatever the house rules are--like no bigotry--let him know what you expect. He can think and feel whatever comes through, but saying it aloud in your home where you are all exposed to it is a no-no. Be firm about what is and is not okay in your house, no matter who is there.

As long as your brother is in your house, you should feel free to talk with him. You don't need to sit aside and wait for Daddy to do it, if he's in your house. Who cares about where he says he wants to live? He can say what he wants. Where is he living NOW? If you want to know why he says it, then ask. If he's not saying it to you, then don't make it your issue. If you want your father know what's going on, just tell him. Tell him matter-of-factly like a grown-up.

I get that this is your family and it's not so easy detach. You seem to know what you're dealing with, though. Adjust your expectations and your responses.