1.2.3. Magic Book

I have a hard time with not mentioning the "bad episode". I learned this with the LOVE AND LOGIC approach. you can chech out dvd's and books on CD. I think the idea is to talk about appropriate behavior when the child is not sensitive.
I have tried this with my 11 YO brother in law. I said "oh bummer" and a few minutes later he started babbling on about what he should have or shouldn't have done. It was awesome. When we "rub it in" children become resentful of us, but if we let them think on it , they will get it on their own and be so proud of themselves.

I agree with you. I feel you should always tell the child what they were doing and why you don't want them to do and also tell them what it is you do want them to do. that last part is so often forgotten. I always hug my kids and tell them I love them afterward too. I don't want them to think that my love is conditional.

I have heard great things about love and Logic and the Dr. Sears Discipline book. Maybe reading a few different books will help you find the method that works best for you. But, I agree, you need to talk to kids about what they did wrong, so that they can learn from it.

I was just reading this because I thought it was interesting. I am always open to new ideas. I may check this out - 1,2,3 - Magic or the Love and Logic one. Personally, I think whatever a parent uses, the most important thing is consistency. I understand about the nagging. My hub is a bigger nagger than me, interestingly. My son knows why he is being corrected, gets his time-out, time-out is over, apologize and move on. If it is a dangerous thing, I always say "Danger". My hub can sometimes go on and on about it. He's a toddler. They have about a 3 second attention span, I tell my hub.

I wanted to tell you what happened yesterday. My toddler son, I have two, was ON the dining table. I told him to get off. I start to count to three and when I was on two, he was almost off so I was about to stop counting. He said to me, "Finish counting." LOL. I said "3" and he got off. Just thought I would share that. I couldn't help but laugh "inside" when he did that.

I have used the 1,2,3 magic approach before. I was first introduced to the program when I worked at a preschool/child-care center. I used it with the 4-year-olds in my classroom with quite a bit of success. I now am at home with my own 2 1/2 year old and have started using it with her to some degree. She has responded very well to it. (I have never gotten to 3 yet.) I see both sides of the argument about explaining the negative actions to your child after the time out. I agree that some discussion could be very valuable in helping your child learn appropriate and inappropriate behaviors--especially with younger children. I certainly talk to my daughter about what is "naughty" and that she needs to apologize when she has misbehaved. This also creates an opportunity to forgive her and tell her how much I love her. Although it is often difficult to get her to say sorry, she is learning and occasionally apologizes without being prompted. (Obviously it is important to model that behavior too--offering an "I'm sorry" when I have done something wrong or hurtful.) I feel that the suggestion to not bring up the negative behavior is a better idea for older children, who already know right from wrong. They may do better knowing that their mistake will not be held over their heads all night or all week. Perhaps it is best to briefly talk about the situation, accept an apology, offer forgiveness and assure the child that it is now in the past. Of course, each child is unique, so what works with one child may not work with another child. I urge you to figure out what works best for you and each of your children.

I used the book and it was a God send for us. Keeps everyone from getting stressed out. Had to read through it several times to get the hang of it.

I read the book & for the most part use it. I have made some adjustments. I found w/any "method", you need to make some adjustments to fit your family. I usually tell my 4 yr old what I want her to do/not do. If she doesn't mind me, then I start counting. I rarely get to 3. When she goes into time-out, she knows why, so I never need to have a discussion about it afterwards - plus when I do, I feel like I'm sorta over-doing it - like I've already punished her - now I'm punishing her again w/a "talk". If she's in time-out for being mean or rude to a family member, then she is to apologize when she gets out of time out, but all is done. I totally agree with time-out being for BOTH parties. I know I need a time-out as much as her - probably more ; ) I like the book - I plan on using it with my almost 2 yr old as soon as he understands the concept of counting. He's quickly learning about the time-out portion. Good Luck!

I absolutely loved this book!!! My son's preschool teacher recommended it since it was the discipline program they were going to be using in school and I wanted to keep the discipline program paralleled and consistent at home. Don't worry about not talking to them--they KNOW why they were "counted on". However, if it will make you feel better, then talk about it when "time's up" and all is calm again--or at bedtime when you recount the day's events with your child. Even then, I'd keep it to a bare minimum since you want to avoid the whole "Little Adult Syndrome". After reading this book, I took notice of many adults (myself included) who just made the whole situation worse by feeding into the child's negative behavior. Nagging is a great example of this. When a child nags, most parents (while not realizing it) encourage nagging by simply answering and responding to it. Parent and child will actually have an entire nagging conversation ABOUT nagging. Really, the easiest thing to do is start counting. If you get to 3, they're put in their room. He/she will know EXACTLY why they were counted on, and you didn't indulge/encourage him/her to continue nagging by continually saying things like "Stop nagging", "Just speak in your normal voice", "I'll get _____ for you in a minute", "You need to act like a big boy/girl" over and over and over again. I don't see a need to talk about the behavior (unless it's something quite major or disturbing). My son always knew what he did. We never discussed it since he already knew the behavior that caused the counting and also since bringing it up again did just that: brought it all up again. This discipline model is actually quite effortless on the part of the parent. It definitely keeps you from sounding like the broken record that kids definitely have learned to tune out. Love it, love it, love it--I highly recommend it!

Hi J.....I am not familiar with the book, but I think you are right on with your gut feeling. I believe it's essential for the disiplice to be effective (the child has learn from the punishment) they need to understand why they have been punished. I have a good book I read called Shepherding a Childs Heart...it works on the heart issues such as if your child is defiant and needs correction the book points out that the punishment does no good if the child does not have a change of heart with his attitude. I agree with the book because it's biblically based and it's done wonders for my family.
Take care, wish you and your family the best.
S.
P.S. I have three boys 6,4 and 6 months

Hi J.

I am not familiar with that book, but I can tell you it does not sound right! Sometimes you have to go with your gut feeling. I tink you are right the child needs to know why they were in time out and what is acceptable and not acceptable. You should ignor the bad behavior and acknowledge another childs good behavior or this child's good behavior. When I read some of these books, I have to sift through the good and bad and take what works best for that individual child. Every child is different. You sound like a good mom!

Marsee

I rarely watch it but every time out on "Supernanny" (TV Show)is followed with explaining what the time out was for, asking the child to explain what s/he did wrong and then asking for an apology and then she follows up with accepting the apology by the adult and a hug. This approach always seems to work and makes complete sense to me.

I think it totally depends on the age and comprehension level. your 4 yr old could probably grasp this but your 18 mo old it probably wouldnt make a difference to talk to him he just needs to know that was wrong.

I have never seen this book, but I am already disturbed by just the part you mentioned.
There is always a magic book out to help mothers to "fix" their children.
Mothers don't need to be told what to do - that breaks down your confidence as a mother.
You may want some advice, but it should not be so specific.
The advice should encourage you to use your mothering instinct to do what is best for your child - who is not any other child. There is no one-size-fits-all solution for any parent-child relationship. And that is what will ultimately provide you with the ability to parent your child - the relationship you have with him.
Look up the books by Dr. William Sears. He knows how to encourage a mother in her inner ability to mother her children without telling them what to do. He has eight wonderful children and a lot of wisdom.

J.,
This is a fantastic form of behavior modification for children. I have three children and have used it successfully with my oldest two (for the past four years)and plan to with our one year old when the time comes. I also have a degree in Early childhood Ed, and taught preschool for over 13 years. 1-2-3 Magic enforces mutual respect, eliminates yelling and spanking (which does not work effectively anyway), is developmentally appropriate for all ages, and IT WORKS! Follow it to a "T" and you will enjoy the results of well behaved children. It not only teaches your children how to behave, but how to behave as the adult in charge of a situation. I have had several other family friends use this with their children, all with great results. I plan on getting Dr. Phelan's program for adolescents next year when my family enters that stage! Your children WILL know what they have done "wrong" because the first thing you will do is make your rules and expectations extremely clear. After a week or so of reminders of the rules and expectaions they will know their boundaries. It is definatley worth the time and effort to get the whole family on board!
Hope this helps and good luck!
Jenny

I haven't read the book, but I agree w/ you.... for sure after discipline, a child needs confirmation that you love them & are not angry w/ him. He also needs to understand what the consequences are for..... :)

I have to say I have no idea what the 1,2,3, magic book is but I do have experience on the no talking to your child after time out.

my brother used to wake up at night when he was really too old to be doing so. (he was almost 2) my mom would go into his room change his diaper and give him water in his bottle and say nothing to him and eventually he must have thought "screw this my mom is ignoring me why should I wake up and try to get her attention?" within a short time he stopped waking up and slept through the night.

if you discipline your child with a time out and "ignore them" afterwards it will work talking to them after wards does not enforce the act of wrongdoing.

you heard of the evil eye I am sure LOL

tell them before time out why they are having the time out and when the time out is over the case is closed--- hopefully they used the time out as thinking time.

remember to not give them hugs and kisses after time out because eventually they may act up just for the hugs and kisses they will get after being bad.

I am not a big fan of that counting thing, I hear parents counting to their child and I want to slap the parent upside the head and after I just read the response of the mommy whose child said finish counting it ---- it seems like a big joke and that child summed it all up as a joke.

I haven't read it, but I have a friend who loves it and told me about it. It sounds a lot like what I do with my kids. First off let me say that counting works. I can ask and beg and threaten, but as soon as I start counting my kids get moving! And as far as the time outs and not saying anything, I heard other parenting advice a while ago that said when you give your kids a time out tell them clearly at the start why they are going to time out (sometimes they really don't know). Then at the end, give them a hug first thing and tell them you love them. Then let them go and both of you move on. Now in practice, usually for minor things I do this, but other times I ask if they know why they had a time out and if they know then I say lets not do it again or they have to apologize or we talk about other choices they could have made and then it is over. But no matter what I always give a hug and tell them I love them first. And when the time out/talking is over...it is over. No one likes being constantly reminded over and over again of mistakes.

Just another word on time outs. I heard a speaker talk about "positive discipline" once (ever heard of it) and she mentioned that the point of a time out is for the child (and the parent) to have time away to calm down and think rationally. She said (and I repeat this to myself often) "children do better when they feel better". I believe that and I have seen it in my kids. Sometimes a time out is so we can get away and feel better. Then we can see how to make the right choices because we are in a better place. As a parent sometimes we want to punish because we are mad. But the point of a consequence is for the child to not do the thing again not for the child to feel like they are evil. So I try to ask myself, is what I am doing helping my child feel better and want to do better. If not, then I need to re evaluate. ANyway, I sort of went off on a tangent, but I think the whole positive discipline theory is really exciting! But to get back on track good luck with the book, I have heard great things about it, and counting does work!!

1,2,3, Magic worked for us..but I think for any type of discipline you need to use consistency. I rarely make it to 3, mostly because the 1, 2 is a reminder to my kids that they are not behaving appropriately. It saves a lot on yelling, always saying "no". We like it. However, I agree on teh not talking after time-out part. we do..it works.
good luck

I disagree with the book regarding not speaking to your child. I know I'm going to sound preachy, but I think God knows us better than any mortal author does! Here's what He says about discipline:

"...reproving betimes with sharpness,when moved upon by the Holy Ghost; and then showing an increase of love toward him whom thou hast reproved, lest he esteem thee to be thine enemy...."

I don't think that giving your child the cold shoulder qualifies as "showing an increase of love", personally.

Kids absolutely need discipline, and I use the 1,2,3 thing A LOT to avoid many of the situations that would require harsher discipline for my kids. It's always good to give them an opportunity to correct their behavior themselves to teach them that they can avoid negative consequences when they modify their behaviors or attitudes.

I don't know about this book but I make sure my kids know why they are being punished so that they will not make the same mistake again. How else are they going to know right from wrong? They are not mind readers!! LOL

sorry can't help you, can't remember much. but i am responding because you made me laugh. my kids are teenagers and "1,2,3 magic" (used in north central parenting group)was the way to go in the days of my oldest, but by the time of my youngest it was "Love & Logic" (used in All Saints Epos. Day School)

Love the book. Our school system uses the approach. They encourage everyone to read the book and try the approach at home. It works. Im sure youve heard the saying " dont beat a dead horst into the ground " You've said it , they heard it, move on. Good Luck

My son attended a preschool where the teacher was also a Marriage and Family Counselor, and she was a big advocate of that book. We have been using it for seven years now, first with my oldest son, and now with our younger one, who is almost five.

To be honest, we barely count them at all anymore, and they are very responsive, sweet natured, and easy children. The thing about not hounding them about their behavior goes along with an idea I love, which is to not make a child FEEL worse to make them ACT better. It has long term repercussions that are undesireable...when a child grows into a teen who is doing anything they can to avoid feeling bad (which we all do) they either turn into liars, or just give up trying to please us and do whatever they want. We want them to WANT to do what we ask, not to do it because they are afraid or trying to avoid feeling bad. The other tactics work when they're little, but set up disaster when they're big.

Good luck! Discipline is a tough one. Just follow your heart and BE CONSISTENT! Children really need good boundaries and lots of love.

Hi J.,

I used the book (tho didn't apply all of it) and it worked well. When I put my daughter into time out, I made sure she knew what went wrong, and then started the clock. I usually did the "let's move on to the next thing/not revisit the bad behavior" approach after her time out. But for really big issues or if she couldn't calm down, we talked about it quietly.

The big thing for me was being firm on the 1,2,3 -- no bartering or cajoling ("you don't want me to get to 3 do you?") or additional chances. Now, all I have to do is start counting and my 3 year old jumps into action.

Good luck!

Hi J.,
I am not familiar with this book. I do not think it is right not to speak with your child after a time out. I believe it is crucial to both the child and yourself that your child understands why and that there and consequences for their poor behavior. I have my children tell ME why they had a time out, so I know they understand and I am not just the one telling them why. (Obviously, your 4 year old would be the one we are talking about. Not the 18 month old.) have the Sheparding a Childs Heart by Tedd Tripp. It is biblically based and very good.
Also, my sister is a therapist and she highly recommends Love and Logic. I have not purchased it yet, but I am going to. Also, Making Your Children Mind, Without Losing Yours by Dr. Kevin Leman is a great book and has insight to managing children as they grow into pre-teens. Sometimes children don't even understand themselves why they do the things they do, so it is important to get to the heart and always discipline with love. I know it isn't always easy!
The biggest mistake I see a lot of parents do is not to follow through! Being consistant and on the same page as your spouse is important and also shows unity and stability for the kids. Good luck.

Hi,
I love the book. I actually just got back from a class about disciplining your toddler and they contradicted the book in that she said to explain to your child why they are being punished because they forget. So, I think the ieas are good, I don't think you should negotiate with them but I don't firmly agree with not saying anything to while you are placing them in the time out.

Good luck!
D.