My children and I were recently invited (by my good friend) to go on a trip, to Florida, for Thanksgiving. We accepted and we're all very excited. I asked her if her sister was going also. She stated that she believed she would be (although they're not on speaking terms). Now, my vehicle holds 7 ppl comfortably and I expressed to my friend that we would need to take both vehicles; mine and hers. She spoke with her sister and her sister declined. A few days later, my friend told her that a certain individual (not a relative/significant other) would be in Florida as well, so her sister changed her mind. I re-expressed to my friend that we will now need two cars for sure. It's a 6hr drive and everyone should be comfortable. It would be 5 children and 2 adults w/o her sister. My friend stated that she doesn't understand why her sister didn't necessarily want to go with us on the trip but wants to go now because of the individual she now knows will be there in Florida. She stated that she was looking forward to riding down together and enjoying each others company. So, with this, my friend shared that she doesn't feel comfortable riding 6 hrs with her sister knowing that they're not on the best of terms. We've already booked the hotel stay of 4d/3n. But her sister shared that she would stay with the boys at their fathers house. So, she asked me for my thoughts. But here are some addt'l details.
Detail #1 I've been living in Georgia for 3 weeks now as of tomorrow. All is going quite well with me and mine, but if you read my past 2 posts you'll see that all isn't well with my friends sister. She's bi-polar, an alcoholic, a cancer survivor and suicidal. Now, a hotline was called, by her sister (my friend) and basically they stated that it's her sister who has to reach out to them for help.
Detail #2 My friend expressed to me that before moving down here, her sister (34) told her that she was jealous of our friendship. 15+ years.
Detail #3 When my friend's sister is drunk, she angers the children by hitting them, provoking them and calling them out of their names.
Detail #4 My friend's sister tells the children that she can't wait to get from around them, because she has no children of her own.
Detail #5 My friends sister is presently in NYC for 2 weeks with their mother to get away.
Detail #6 They had a very, very bad argument before her NYC trip because she was drunk, hitting her 10yr old (while trapping him in the closet). My friend was out at a restaurant when this was happening and because the child was screaming her eldest sent her a text to come home. And because the eldest has been called out of his name by her, they aren't speaking either.
I just want to be a support for my friend and her children. I've had dramatic situations within my own bloodline but I had to stand firm and make hard decisions in order to have peace. I shared with my friend that I'm uncomfortable giving her feedback on her sibling but that she has the power to stand firm on whatever it is that she believes she should do.
Thoughts please?
THANK YOU to all those who responded. Much appreciated.
mynewnickname, it's crossed my mind to decline but the truth is that I refuse to have her rain on my parade. She has no power over me and me and mine will have a great time in Florida. She's not allowed in my vehicle nor will I ever allow her to be a disruption to my children. On another hand, my friend has the personality type where she feels like she has to be a savior to people. But I've shared with her that that isn't her job. We all have to learn our own lessons.
Yes. My friend could use some counseling for sure. She's quite stressed and overwhelmed.
tadpole, yes, I agree. She needs pro-help because she's a master manipulator. They're mother is too. When her sister does wrong, she calls their mother and the mother puts the responsibility on my friend. It's a cycle. I shared with my friend that she's taking on too many roles and it's just not her place. She has to learn how to love people without sacrificing her peace of mind by allowing people to make her feel the way she does.
Elena, you're so right. I'm going to follow up with my friend this eve to see where she stands and I'm going to encourage her to use wisdom.
Elayne and Elaine, thank you. Trust, I will be removing myself sooner than you believe.
B, my feelings exactly.
Diane, wow, I didn't see myself as being manipulated in all of this. Thanks for shedding light on that.
Bp, I agree. Thank you.
Marda, I have my own vehicle and my friend has her own. The sister would've been together and I would've driven the children. Yes, at times I do seek validation. Unfortunately I had a narcissistic mother who manipulated me for a long time. It took me over 30 years to even recognize manipulation because I grew up with it all of my life. But yes, in taking a personality test I came to understand that I am capable of giving so much that I neglect myself. I did this throughout my entire 20s. I no longer do that anymore.
Nervygirl, I actually did just that and didn't bite my tongue. I told her that my vote was a no, and I meant it. I'm going to take your advice and refrain from being pulled into this. I don't even think my friend knows she's burdening me with foolishness she alone has the power to end. I had to separate myself from my own sister but not to replace her with another "sister" who could possibly be worse.
Osohapi, it's a reunion with my friends children's father's family. Her ex-hubby's family. I only know the husband and her sister isn't related to any of them. We didn't book the hotel before I inquired about the sister. Actually, I didn't believe that my friend would be foolish enough to invite her knowing their history and present issues. But, she was. Not sure why. From here on out, I'm going to be more confident in my feelings and decisions and also hold my friend more accountable for hers, especially is she's trying to involve me in something negative I didn't create. But at this point, NO ONE will ruin my plans. Not my friend or her sister. That's for sure.
Update: She'll be staying in NYC as she recently became drunk and fell twice. Their mother will make attempts to get her into rehab while she's there.
Too much drama for me. I'd tell her (nicely) that you think it'll be a little too crazy if more people join the group so If she wants to go with them, let her and you guys can do something else at a later time.
ooh heck no. This is a disaster in the making. DO NOT go. You will be put in a situation that will be so stressful, you might lose your friendship over it. Even long-term friendships get tested and lose.
Your best friend's sister is hitting rock bottom and is taking everyone with her. For the sake of your sanity, your friendship and kids? DO NOT GO.
You cannot fix this. It's not your job nor your place to fix this.
You are able to see the dysfunctional triad of the friend-mom-sister.
But I don't think you see your role in the dysfunctional relationship of the unstable sister-friend sister-friend (you).
Giving your friend feedback about her sister, which is just really pulling you into their drama (which your friend repeatedly seems to do to you), is just adding fuel to a very toxic relationship.
I think you need to distance yourself from this friend until you have very firm boundaries with her and can stop being part of the drama.
What could you say to your friend that she possible doesn't already know about her sister? Or their relationship? Honestly.
I think the best feedback you could give your friend is that you love yourself enough to distance yourself from her until she can make the friendship about the two of you without letting in the chaos.
I think the real question is why do you keep letting this happen?
Many good points below. I think you have to look at the fact that your friend keeps involving her sister in things that she absolutely knows her sister will disrupt. Your friend invited you while thinking it was possible her sister would be there. Then you drew a line in the sand about 2 vehicles (and very wisely so), so your friend kind of talked her sister out of it. Then your friend decided to tell her sister that this other 3rd party would be there - what in the world was your friend's rationale, other than enticing the sister to come after all or to be the center of attention in this drama? Perhaps your friend thinks that you are a peace-maker here, but that's putting all the pressure on your. Perhaps your friend cannot say no - but now that is becoming your problem.
Why would you spend good money to go on a trip where you will be on eggshells all the time wondering if the drunk sister will show up, will be in your hotel, will make dinner time difficult, or whatever else? Even though you will keep the sister from being in your car and with your kids, you cannot keep her out of a hotel, away from the Thanksgiving dinner table, or away from a restaurant where, presumably, alcohol and her sister (your friend) will be readily available to fuel an episode?
Stop allowing your friend to manipulate you to make her life better. I get that she may want to surround herself and her children with "friends who are like family" but that doesn't mean you have to sacrifice your own holiday and peace of mind just so your friend doesn't have to make a decision.
I'd cancel, saying very sympathetically to your friend that you understand that she cannot control her sister, so all you can control is whether or not you are in the same town.
Kee,
I'm sorry - your story is complicated.
I would tell my friend to take her own car and you drive your kids and meet them there.
There is nothing but drama in this story. Since the sister is going? I might just refuse to go so I don't get wrapped up in the drama. NOTHING good will come from this. I'm sorry, that's not what you want to hear but that's my opinion.
This is a story wrought with emotion and family ties. While you have a long, enduring friendship? it's going to be complicated during this trip and will test everyone's limits.
ETA after your SWH: Now I'm even more confused. Your friends sister changed her mind because it's your friends EX HUSBANDS FAMILY? She isn't even related to them! Why on earth would your friend CALL and invite her sister if she doesn't even LIKE her???? She purposely opened that can of worms. You said your self she wasn't going until she found out "someone" was going to be in FL that she wanted to see. I would have your friend ride with you and leave the sister to her own devices to get there. She may not even show. In the future, I would set CLEAR boundaries with your friend and if she continues to not be able to set her own boundaries, I would distance myself from the drama for sure. Good luck.
ORIGINAL: I'm wondering with all these "details" you list, why you didn't say with WHO you are having Thanksgiving with in FL. Is it your friends parents? That would help to know.
Regardless, I guess before I accepted and got my kids all excited I would have figured out the sister issue first. But instead you accept, then tell the kids and book the hotel. Then you ask if she will be there and your friend doesn't really know either but it sounds like it now and so you aren't happy and neither is she.
I guess if I felt like I had a place to go away from the sister when I was in FL that would make a difference. Like if Tgiving is at their parents house and she acts up, you and your friend and the kids can head out and go hang somewhere else. But if everyone will be sort of "stuck" at the house, then I would not risk my kids being around that.
Not for ONE minute would I want my Thanksgiving ruined, especially for the kids. So I guess it's hard to offer a solution or my opinion when I don't know the whole FL story. In the future, get the details first and if the sister ends up being there, have a Plan B in place already to get away from her. Good luck.
Sounds to me if the alcoholic sister is going then you shouldn't be.
I wouldn't be subjecting my kids to what ever is going on with her.
You need to make it clear to your friend that you are HER FRIEND - and not her SISTERS friend - and you don't want to be.
If your friend can't keep you separated from her sister - then I'd have to think twice about continuing to see this friend.
So - your feedback on her sister should be:
"I don't want myself or my kids dealing with her. I'm happy doing things with you and your kids but when your sister is involved then please count me out.".
After your SWH: sounds like you're thinking that if you "fix" your friend u won't have any more difficulty because she will stop putting you in the middle or some such thing. Not true. You will be the me rson who has.asked us about twoother situations in which you were able to say no at the rest me u re asked to do something. Please an about co-dependency. I had a difficult time admitting I am co-dendendent. I am ververy glad I learned to recognize it and how to get change my reactions. I can say I'm.happier and more confident.
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With this history, I don't understand why you'd offer giving her a ride let alone be willing todrive two of your cars. If she has her own car, why would you drive in tandem? I also don't understand why your friend would be OK with her sister coming. I suggest both of you need to say no, this will not work for you. When you say no, give no other explanation. IF you try to make her understand, she will argue with you and you'll have more drama.
It's very important to take care of yourself and your family first. DRama is debilitating. You will not have fun if she's involved.
You have past history to know this.
I suggest counseling will help you to have confidence in yourself and your decisions. You have good insight and know what is right for you. Yet you waiver and seem to need validation from others before being able to say no. It seems that you need to please others, giving them priority over your needs and those of your family. Why are you willing to compromise your's and your family's happiness to help someone else?
I urge you to learn about co-dependency in relationships. There are many good books available.
I certainly would not put my children or myself in a car for 6 hours with your friend's sister, whether she was the driver or a passenger. If the sister wants to go to Florida, I guess there's nothing to stop her, but I wouldn't accommodate her, transportation or hotel or otherwise.
I'd tell your friend that when the plans were made, it was just you, your friend, and your children. Too late now to add an additional passenger. And your friend's sister will have to make her own plans, because 6 hours in a car with a suicidal, mentally ill, abusive, angry, alcoholic person would not be safe for any person.
And I'd make sure that your hotel room was not available to this sister. Are you going to have dinner at a restaurant or at a family's home?
Why on earth would your friend tell her sister that someone special was going to be in Florida at the same time?
Personally, this doesn't sound like a relaxing and enjoyable trip or Thanksgiving. I'd cancel the whole thing and encourage your friend to get counseling to understand the boundaries she needs to keep with regard to her sister. Your kids deserve safety and peace.
I think if the sister is out of control she should 1) not be around children 2) someone who can should intervene to help the children she is hitting. To me, that would be the first and most urgent piece of business on the agenda.
Adults can seek help, adults can leave, little kids are trapped. I'd focus on helping them.
I think you can be supportive and have boundaries which respect yourself and your family's needs. Personally, given the history, if the friend had told me "sister might be coming, what do you think?" I would have said, "you know, I'm looking forward to this with my family and while I know you love your sister and want to support her, I would prefer for this trip to be just us and the kids". End of statement.
I think Diane B is right that you are getting pulled into their toxic goo. On the surface, your friend sounds like she's being caring, but from my perspective, she's being disrespectful to both you and her sister. She's involving you in a way she has no business doing and she's badmouthing her sister, while making the 'does she go with us' blame fall squarely on your shoulders. She should have just stepped up in the beginning and decided not to include her sister this time. Or said a confident "no, this is a trip with friends". Her involving you flies a red flag for me, personally. Imagine, if you had friends behaving like this, would you feel differently? Resist being put in the middle, let your friend make her own choices and own them.
You say immediately "I asked her if her sister was going also."
STAY OUT OF IT.
Drive yourself & your kids.
Don't discuss your friends relationship with her sister AT ALL with her.
I agree with Wild Woman, it's not going to go well and it's not worth it, especially where the kids are concerned. I've been thru similar situations thinking it'd be fine "this time", but guess what, it's not. Her sister is trouble and she should uninvite her. She obviously didn't want to go until she found out a particular person was going to be there, That says it all. She is sh**ing on her family. Tell your friend there's no sense in her being with her, the kids or anyone if anyone wants to have fun and enjoy their vacation.
I don't understand why you don't just take your own family in your own car, and your friend can do the same. Seems like a lot of drama over nothing.
Man your really in it, aren't you! I used to get myself in mess like this all the time, often attempting to play mediator.. it goes very wrong fast and I end up sore and tired. I've had to learn that I can't be that person anymore.
You need to examine the part you are playing in all of this hot mess. I for one would back out, and find another time to go to Florida.
I just know I can get myself in situations like this one, but if they at all involve kids or my own family-I back out gracefully. It sounds like too much of a toxic environment to even have an enjoyable holiday. Be safe and decline. NOW
