Help Me Settle This Debate... Juice. :)

home made juice from a juicer is just as nutritious, all she is missing out on is the fiber in the skins, but if she is also eating the pulp than she is not missing anything. JUICE AWAY!

100% juice is considered to be a serving of fruit. Ask the government. They tell child care centers what they can and cannot serve in their facilities. The food programs that refund part of child care facilities food bills count 100% fruit juice to be a serving of fruit too.

I think lots of mom's just want to be controlling of their kids diet and don't want to do juice. Which is fine with me but we do Juicy Juice. A serving is 4oz. That's not much juice for a day. The rest of the fruit on the pyramid should come from fresh or canned.

This debate will go on and on and on until the kids in these families grow up. They will eat and drink everything they were deprived of as a child. Kids need a normal balanced diet without all the fads of the day interfering with their nutrition.

So just ignore her comments.
Everyone is different.
Yah, overbearing, huh?

Just eat the whole fruit.

TWO things to remember:

1) Fiber has NO nutritional value. We can't digest it. Because we can't digest it our body flushes it through our system (and anything that happens to be with it) faster than things it CAN digest. For adults, this is particularly important. But early childhood nutrtition and adult nutrition are RADICALLY different creatures. (Just as an example; children need high fat diets, and adults need low fat diets. ONE of the things fiber helps with adults is to get the fat out of our digestive tract BEFORE the lipids are absorbed). You can eat cardboard, fabric, or other inedible things to the *exact* same effect as fiber found in fruits, veggies, legumes, etc.

2) In order to change the nutritional content of a food, a chemical reaction has to occur. Adding heat (cooking), denaturing (adding an acid, or base, or enzyme, or freezing), or adding other chemicals. Cooking makes some foods MORE nutritious (by freeing up nutrients that were bound -typically- to fiber... remember, we can't digest it), and makes some foods LESS nutritious (because the chemical reaction makes volatile nutrients go airborn or denature).

Are you removing the fiber by juicing? Yeah. Which has no nutritional value, and we can't digest it. Which means that we absorb the other nutrients FAR easier (because -you're going to get tired of this phrase- you've removed the no-nutrient-inedible part which flushes it through our system).

mehhh...
You probably do lose a little bit of fiber content overall, but not enough to argue about, geez. I'd be happy to see HALF the population do what you do as opposed to just pouring juice from a pre-packaged container. LOL

ETA: do NOT add the apple seeds in. Look it up if you want to know why.
http://www.livestrong.com/article/188977-apple-seed-toxic...

Since I'd hate the pulp left behind, I kind of don't see the point in juicing. But I think the argument is kind of pointless. There's so much sugar in real fruit. The difference between natural sugar and refined sugar is not as big as people make it out to be. I'd say you are both doing well. Now put some celery and pears through your juicer for one drink and some apple/carrot for another and you have some great combos nutrition wise.

Well, technically speaking, I think your friend is right. But I would NEVER tell someone else I think they are depriving their child of nutrients no matter what they feed them. You do what you want with your child, and she can do what she wants with her child.

Whole fruits, with peels are better. Juicing fruit is a lot better than bought juice so I would still count that as really healthy. Fresh fruit is better than bought juice and I don't count that as fruit at all.

We have teeth for a reason.
Juicing is ideal for the toothless tho.

A juice/pulp combo is not "just as healthy" as the whole fruit unless you are taking the WHOLE fruit and turning it, in it's entirety, into juice (for example, berries.) It makes us think back to our elementary science lessons (so long ago!!!) :) about how changing the form of something...it's shape, etc...does not change it's make-up. In order to change a substance, you need to add heat, etc.

So really, I think it depends on what kinds of fruit you are using. I'm sure there are health benefits to the peels of fruit (haven't done the research, don't really care) :) etc, and now they're trying to spook everyone into thinking whole apples are bad for you...arsenic, etc. I can say, personally, I ate at least TWO WHOLE apples every day for about 20 years straight, including core, seed, and stems (I just really liked apples) and I'm pretty sure I'm not dead from arsenic poisoning.

Some people on health rants can really have a holier-than-thou attitude that stinks. There's a big difference from the parents who is putting apple juice or kool-aid in a baby's bottle for nap and bedtime than the parents who gives their child 4 oz. 100% juice diluted by half for breakfast (which is what I do with my six year old, always HAVE done, and she has beautiful teeth.)

Juice is a never-ending argument, though. Juice is not as healthy as a whole fruit because it's concentrated, higher in calories and sugar, but less sustaining and really is missing a lot of the fiber, etc, that a whole fruit might have.

I'm sure somewhere in the middle is probably best. My youngest doesn't like juice and doesn't drink it, so (besides breastmilk) she drinks only water...sometimes plain, sometimes flavored with MiO. She's 19 months old, and drinks out of a straw cup or a regular cup. I get some NASTY looks sometimes if she's carrying a cup...and I just want to scream...IT'S WATER!!!!

yes, I would consider juice/pulp combo just as healthy as whole fruit. I fail to see the difference, unless, of course, she is eating the skin from the orange lets say?! (lol). Actually, what a good idea to add the "juice" with oatmeal! I'll have to remember that!

I don't think you are going to get a 100% certified 'right' answer on which is better. Too many variables... (is juice better than no fruit? what about for kids who have sensory issues around the pulp and would benefit from the vitamins coming straight from the food itself... too many different aspects to consider for one or the other to be 'the best' way.)

I prefer to have my son eat whole fruit and veggies; we don't buy juice at all. I like that he gets the fiber and pulp. That said, juice is considered as a 'sweet treat' because of the high fructose content and lack of pulp/beneficials; he gets it at outings to restaurants. It's a special thing. What you are doing, in moderation, is fine. What we want to avoid is *replacing* food with juices. Kids do tend to fill up on juice because it's sweet and they tend to go for that first, eschewing the proteins and fiber offered on the plate. I know my son would do that...:)

One other suggestion: don't let what others do affect how *you* perceive what you do. I've discovered that it doesn't help me to 'win' an argument with my friends over stuff like this, what helps is to go forward feeling confident that I am comfortable with my own parenting choices. You aren't likely to change her mind, even if you had proof. She's convinced she's right. In this situation, I usually just drop the subject and focus on other things we agree on.

It's not "unhealthy" to drink juice, it's just excessive natural sugar. You get all the sugar of several/many pieces of fruit (depending on juice) but none of the fiber from the rest of the fruit, which is the most important part. But you do still get vitamins. We drink juice watered down to save juice and spare sugar, but also eat real fruit for the fiber. Also, we blend smoothies with whole fruit, peel and all (they don't know it-it's organic and washed well) and even some greens (they don't know it). That way it's a liquid, but fiber isn't removed. And if we're at a party or something, and they can run it off, I don't get too uptight about some straight juice if it's a choice between soda or something.

It's not as healthy as whole fruit, in that it does not contain any fiber such as from skin or pulp, but it's not soda either. My daughter gets orange juice in the morning that I water down 50/50 and she's been fine. No dental decay issues, weight issues, etc. She also gets a lot of actual fruit though too, so it's not as if it's the only "fruit" in her diet. For a long time she would not drink milk, so the calcium-fortified o.j. is what she got and the pediatrician thought that was fine. She also drinks plenty of plain straight water, so that's not an issue either

As long as your child is actually eating whole fruits and veggies, and not getting excess calories from juice, I don't think it's a big deal. If your friend wants to be a "food nazi", let her, but I think you are doing just fine. It could be worse - my SIL gives her 2 year old Sunny Delight and Capri Suns and calls it "juice" and Yoo-Hoo chocolate drink and calls it "milk".

Juice is great, but fruit is better. the vitamins in juice and the abundance of how many you can get is certainly a plus but the fiber in whole fruits is important too.

You are both right.

Fiber is very important for our colon health to move food along, its also essential to digest fiber along with sugars (natural or otherwise) so that our bodies can properly use those sugars and our blood sugar does not spike fast and then crash. Not enough proper fiber is a main factor in digestive disorders and diabetes,

The simple truth it, anything less then whole fruit...is absolutely second best. She is right that the juicing process depletes much of the nutritional value. (Especially, fiber. That happens to be very important!!) Especially, when you start cooking it really takes down the value of the fruit. Fruit cooked in things should not even be put towards a fruit serving, in my opinion. No, I wouldn't consider juice and pulp a serving. It's just does have the nutritional value of biting into an apple. Drinking our food, is never as healthy as eating in whole form. That much is proven. As a rule, I don't think it's a good idea to replace fruit serving with juices.

With all that said, I don't care what other people do!! I do what I do, because I want to. I would never tell anyone what they are doing is wrong. I wouldn't even notice or care!!

P.S.
The government also considers PIZZA a vegetable for schools and. I wouldn't listen to them anytime soon, for the record. Oh, and I do allow my son to have juice!! I just don't replace servings of fruit with juice, if that makes sense. Fiber is ESSENTIAL to a healthy diet for ALL ages. To say it has not "nutritional value" is 100% false. If it has no nutritional value, it would not be suggested, or required. It reduces the risk of a whole host of diseases, and protects our bodies as we grow.

I didn't get to read all of the responses but having a nutrition minor, etc. I thought I would put my two cents in. Juicing is not the same thing as eating the whole fruit. On average you lose anywhere between 20-40% of the nutrients, fiber, etc. Plus you have to drink the juice within 15-20 minutes to get whatever nutrients are left absorbed (big reason why I don't buy juice - to me I just see sugar water). BUT your daughter is eating the pulp so there is your fiber you would have been missing otherwise. I think what you are doing is great. I juice for my kids all the time, make popsicles out of it, etc. I mean there are so many factors when it comes to food and its controversies: raw food vs steamed/cooked (raw: better but harder for your organs to break it down. Cooked: you cook away a percentage of nutrients but its easier for your body to absorb); organic vs non organic, local vs overseas. The list goes on. Any time you alter food - juice it, cook it, steam it, etc. it will change the nutrition content. But not terribly, you are still getting nutrients and getting her to crave fresh fruits and veggies which is the ultimate goal with kids. Establishing those healthy eating habits early is awesome!!

Well, I'm sure the whole fruit is healthier, but the juice & pulp separated is almost as good, and better than what a lot of people feed their kids.

It sounds like you like this woman, so why don't you just keep the topic of nutrition off the table?

You would probably consider me psycho about nutrition too! But I think what you are doing is great. I don't know if a juicer changes nutritional content as long as the pulp is there, and it can't be the same as buying watery processed sugary juices. Whole fruit is best,, and I consider a fresh juiced fruit whole fruit. Except of course if you take the skin off for example which you should probably do if it's not organic...

The only other problem I have with juice is that it encourages sugary drinks. I think kids shoud get 99% of their liquid from water. But that is a different issue altogether!

Yes, I would and what you feed your kids and what she feeds hers really is no big deal so long as you respect each other's desires when you baby sit for the other.

Just as healthy? Eh I dunno - But I'd guess it's a heck of a lot better than the juice box I give my kid!

From what I understand, the skin of certain fruits and veggies have 'bonus' vitamins, so if her kid is eating an apple with the skin and your kid is drinking the juiced apple, then I would guess maybe that her kiddo is getting a little bit "more" as far as vitamins and minerals. Granted, I don't know how a juicer works. Does it grind up the apple peel? And the seeds? (I have heard that the seeds of apples have great nutrition too - good blenders can make smoothies with the whole apple minus the stem). So depending on your juicer, perhaps your kids are getting equal nutrition. Perhaps your kids are missing a tiny bit.

Another point to consider is that lets say her kid eats one apple, one banana, an orange, and one serving of peas in a day. Your kid gets juice made with oranges, apple, kale, blueberries, and carrots. Plus they eat a banana for breakfast, plus they eat peas at dinner. YOUR kid got more variety therefore more nutrition, more vitamins, right?

added: I recently learned that apple seeds have cyanide??? So do your research before juicing everything! Who knew?

.

Who cares what your friend believes. If your daughter enjoys juice then let her have it unless it spoils her appetite for a meal. Juice and pulp is certainly better than no fruit at all.

I don't give my children "juice" either. There is no nutritional value in juice bought at a grocery store. However, there is great great great nutritional value in fresh fruit juice made at home. Nothing can replace a whole fruit, but in juicing a fruit you also get certain vitamins and minerals out of the fruit that your body cannot break down in eating the whole fruit or veggie raw. They are called the micro nutrients. There is a film called "Fat Sick and Nearly Dead" that is very informative about the benefits of juicing. We watched it and are now a juicing family. You and your friend are both "right", juicing is great and so is eating fresh fruit and veggies....

When you juice the fruit and give her both the juice and pulp you are giving her the whole fruit. She's getting exactly the same whether it's the whole fruit in solid form and the whole fruit in liquid form. They are both the same and have the same nutrients.

I suggest she is thinking of juice without the pulp. Juice alone and whole fruit are different.

i'm not a nutrition nazi by any means, but it's fact that juice is not as good as whole fruit. it is okay (if you don't believe all the hype about arcenic, AND you make sure, as you noted, that it is 100% juice with nothing else added), but it does not have the fiber (and probably other nutrients?) that whole fruit does - it couldn't, could it? that's just common sense.

i am not one to buy juice for my son. if he gets it from school or other people's houses i am not going to freak out. but i don't see the need. i'd rather he just have an apple. we are water drinkers in our house. zero need for juice.

I thought, (could be wrong) that portion control was the hard thing with fruit juices. It's easier to overconsume fruit in juice form (sugar is the concern) than it is to sit down and eat the same number or actual pieces of fruit. If you're doing this in moderation I don't see the problem though...... You may need to tell your friend you're done talking about this.

Certainly what you are making for her in the juicer is of better nutritional value than packaged, processed juice. But packaged juices typically don't have added sugar, the sugar is natural sugar. Even that natural sugar can cause tooth decay and juice has a lot of calories. A serving of fresh juice a day, especially diluted for a young child (not an infant) is probably just fine, but if it's several times a day, I would likely cut down and let her eat the fruit.

This article explains the benefits of eating the pulp and skins of fruit:

http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=george&dbid=24

She sounds overbearing and seems to be a "miss know it all" type when it comes to nutrition. Since you say she has good traits, though, I would keep her as a friend, YET..... agree that detailed opinions on certain subjects such as nutrition and raising your kids, should not be shared. Just my 2 cents, though!

I wouldn't consider the juice/pulp combo just as healthy. You lose some fibre. But, if you're juicing, and eating other whole fruits, then what's the problem? Also, fresh juices are delicious!

I WANT TO POINT OUT SHE SAID SHE IS USING A JUICER THEREFORE USING WHOLE FRESH FRUIT/VEGGIES

DO yu have one of those things that pulverizes and then spits out the juice but keep the pulp in another compartment... or is that what a juicer does... i wouldnt know! LOL

your both right...
she is right in that taking the peel away n such changes the nutrition but your giving it to her later anyway so it doesnt matter... (however cooking changes nutrients too)

You need to look at the nutritional content of juice and compare that to the nutritional content of the fruit. I don't give my kids juice for the same reason. I'd rather they drink water and eat an apple than drink apple juice. As long as you're not replacing the fresh fruit with a serving of juice, it really doesn't matter.

I love that you received so many responses! I wish I had a infant/toddler nutrition group like this for questions, as I often have them!!!
I love when my toddler sees the source of the food. You are teaching your daughter where juice comes from. Not a box. To me, this is important in lifelong eating choices. I find juicing to be particularly healthy because heat kills vitamin C, and juicing is a great way to get this great vitamin into your body. Your friend is overlooking that you are not serving juice from concentrate.
Nutritional value changes with chemical reactions, as others have said, and if you can serve a vitamin c with an iron, you are ahead in the bioavailability of the nutritional value of the meal. (if she serves the iron with water, you have won that nutritional battle) I wouldn't go overboard, but it sounds like you are in moderate territory.

Yep. To me it is the same! Whether you drink it or chew it should not matter.

I think both are true depending on the individual. I think juicing is great for getting more vitamins and minerals (because you can get several servings of fruit/veg in one glass). So really good for people who have deficiencies, or growing children, or people who don't need to watch their weight. But one thing that most adults don't eat enough of is fiber, and to boot they are overweight and eat to many calories. For these people eating the whole fruit is better. If you can't get whole fruit down your kids, then juicing is a good choice. I think your friend is right, all things being equal, eating the whole food is better. What she is to thick headed to recognize is that, your kid probably would not eat the same quantity of fruit/ veg if it wasn't juiced. I think I've found the both of best words, I grind the whole fruit, fiber and all into a smoothie.

Absolutely! Juicing, imo, makes it easier for the body to get the whole vitamins because it's liquid. It just doesn't have the fiber of whole fruit. But since you are giving her whole fruit and the pulp in her diet anyway, I'd say you are golden!

Hi-
I am one of those freaks about nutrition, too. :-) Juice that comes in a bottle--not so good. The enzymes are dead and it's mostly just sugar. However, juicing it fresh retains the enzymes and it's not like you're adding extra sugar. The other problem with "juice" is the lack of fiber and nutrients that you miss by just having the juice. But you're still giving her that in another form. So in a way you are both right. I don't think you can count just juice as a "fruit" because of the missing fiber and vitamins, BUT that isn't what you are doing. In this case, you win :-)
J.

um...you are both getting fruits...good for you! I see so many people feeding their kids junk that I am proud you are doing what you are doing. I think it is all the same,

Yeah, I think since your child is eating the pulp too, that's better than just the juice. But, I do agree with the others that said even fresh juice right from the fruit should be limited. Part of the benefit of whole fruit is the fiber you get from eating it, plus the skins of certain fruit as well. If you're just drinking the juice you aren't getting the nutritional benefits of that, but when she eats the pulp it does add some of that back in.

In the end, I personally think your friends sounds a little extreme! If it were me, though, I'd probably only give my child 1, maybe 2 of those glasses of juice each day even if they are fresh.

Check in with a nutritionist, your friend is wise choosing to serve water and fresh fruit. One juice glass serving is okay for an adult (less for a child), but whole fruit is best. There's a reason why diabetics aren't to drink juice. And just fyi, any fruit or other carbs should always be balanced with protein.

Unless she gives her child the skins she's not giving her child anything that's better than what you give your child giving them juice with pulp.

Ask a Nutritionist. ...I'm personally against a lot of fruits, and tend to focus on veggies much more, so that's my take on the whole thing. I say, keep it more veggie heavy, and not as much fruit... juice or not.

Oh boy, I can relate with the whole food-psychotic friend thing! It is annoying! I have a friend who berated me for giving my kdis dried mangos because sugar is added in the processing, like all of a sudden that makes the mango totally devoid of nutrition! Perhaps the proteins in fruit or veggies can become denatured a bit in the juicing process, but I highly doubt that the nutritional value changes very much if at all. Since your child is eating the pulp as well as drinking the juice I'd say that is just about as healthy as eating unprocessed fruit. And really, it sounds like you are feeding your child better than the majority of parents already so don't sweat it!