Do You Punish for This?

The "punshiment" for a tired three year old throwing a fit is that she not get what she wanted. You can't punish emotions and at such a young age she is not in control of hers just yet.

Today she learned that no matter how awful she acts when you say NO you mean it. Good job, now move on.

No. She wanted a toy. You said no. She threw a fit. I would just ignore the fit and then go about the day.

You did a good job. No more punishment necessary.

Zoo trips can be hard. :-/ Hot, tiring, etc. Fun, but, a lot to handle.

No, you don't punish a 3-1/2 year old for that, you just immediately remove her from the store, just like you did. If you remove her from the situation every time she melts down, and don't let her have what she wants, she will learn that it's not okay to melt down.

That's appropriate consequences and discipline, not "punishment." Punishment is rarely necessary. You are teaching and guiding your child.

Kids generally melt down because they don't have the language or coping skills to express how they feel about something. Your response was correct and it will teach her that tantrums don't get her what she wants. Punishment isn't needed. You DID discipline but not giving in. By leaving, you basically did the same discipline you do at home. You removed her from the situation and she didn't get her way.

Why "punish" her?
She wanted stuff.
You said no.
She had a fit.
You stood your ground.
Game over.

You did all that was needed by not giving into her demands I think.

Zelda:

Waiting until you get home to punish is like waiting one week to punish.

You said no. You took her away. You stood firm and did not cave. What further punishment is needed?

I would make it clear what my expectations are when we arrive. We are NOT purchasing anything from the gift shop. State the consequences of having a tantrum.

Keep it Simple. State your expectations. DO NOT cave. DO NOT give in. The minute you move the line - she will know you are not serious about the consequence....

I think you did the right thing. You did not give in to her tantrum and immediately removed her from the situation.

I wouldn't go any further than what you did. You removed her from the situation and she will quickly learn that a meltdown will get her nothing but removed from where ever she is.

At 3 1/2 she is learning boundaries and you did the right thing to leave with no treats!

My daughter did this once around 3 in the grocery store. I had my cart all loaded and ready to go. I told her if she continued to melt down, we would leave with no groceries at all. She continued. I rolled my cart to the back of the store where the coolers were located. This was my regular grocery so I knew the store and many employees. I asked them to keep my cart in the cooler please and I would return later. I picked up my daughter, walked out of the store, got in the car and went home. She looked shellshocked.... After hubby got home, I went back to the grocery and finished my shopping. It was a pain in the rear but we never had another episode like that one again. I also refrained from letting her go with me to the store a few times.

No additional punishment was needed in this case..... you didn't give in to the situation (she wanted you to buy her something, but you didn't), and you also removed her from the situation.... you left the area of the gift shop AND the zoo...

Yes, you were already on the way out, but you did what you could in the situation.

She did calm down quickly, which shows that she will learn.

Keep up the good work!

What K-Bell said. By the time you got home to punish her, she would have forgotten what she was in trouble for. I think firmly telling her no and sticking to it despite her meltdown was all that was needed. Good job!
A.

No.
What you did was fine.

Nope - at 3.5 she's not old enough to connect the tantrum at the zoo with punishment at home. Besides, she probably threw that tantrum because she was hot, overtired, hungry, overstimulated, etc. The zoo is a tough place for little kids (parents too sometimes). And really, you already basically punished her by not giving in and getting her a toy.

No, totally normal. She was tired, she wanted something, you said no like a normal person would do, she reacted because her reasoning skills went bye bye.

It's too late now. She was tired. Let this one go.

No punishment needed. You didn't give in, and when you didn't give in, she settled down. Mission accomplished.

nope. 3 year olds are creatures of the moment, and so should their consequences. it's not unusual for a toddler, especially one who is probably tired and over-stimulated, to have a meltdown. you handled it just fine at the time. you don't punish little people for being little and acting like little people.
khairete
S.

She's 3 1/2 and the tantrum is done. I don't see any added benefit to further punishment at home.

Not sure if you did this or not (you don't really address it in your post), but in the future, be sure you "warn" her in advance adequately if you foresee something she is going to want and that you have no plans on giving to her. Zoos and amusement parks are notorious for "gift shops" at the exit. We always tell our kids that we can walk through and look, but that we aren't planning on buying anything.
Then, if we DO decide to get something (even something small) they are thrilled, and if we decide that every bit of it is overpriced junk, they don't go in with any expectation of buying anything.

We have never been ones to load up at the gift shop, either. Sometimes a Tshirt, or a few zoos we have gotten stuffed animals of a favorite (the year the panda was a brand new exhibit at the Atlanta Zoo for instance)... but usually, nothing. And it is forgotten about before we even get seat belts buckled in the car.

Nope, you said no and she didn't like it. Too bad. Tantrums usually only continue when a child knows they work (meaning they end up getting attention and/or what they want.)
But I feel for you, it's easier at home when you can send them to their room, in the car the whole family suffers :-(

No. By the time you got home, the moment was over. The time for a timeout is as the tantrum is occuring.

Too young for punishment at home. Stopping tantrums comes from immediate discipline so they never learn to proceed. You may think letting her calm down in her room is discipline for fits, but really it is allowing her to tantrum as long as she wants to in her room. It will not prevent the next one which is why she's still doing this at 3 1/2. I recommend the book Back to Basics Discipline if you don't want her melting down when she doesn't get her way.

I just thwarted an "exiting zoo, passing by gift shop" tantrum myself with my extremely spirited 4 year old (just turned) with a warning, but that's because tantrums have NEVER been allowed, so the warning sufficed.

Punishing at home wouldn't have helped at that age, it was too long after the fit. Good for you putting your foot down and not giving in.
However, what you should do is go over the situation with her to make sure it doesn't happen again.
When my DS was about 4, it was a pain to take him to the store. He never stayed with me, he took everything off the shelves, he asked for everything and wouldn't just take no for an answer. I had had enough of this. I learned about training, which is just going over the situation before it happens and teach them how you want them to act. So, we set up the living room like it was the store by putting many of his toys on the couch and tables and we walked thru the living room like it was the store. I told him what I expected of him, to walk with me, not touch anything and if he wants to look at something he needs to point to it not touch it. If I tell him he can't have something, he is to answer O.K., nothing more. After doing this 2xs, the next time we went to the store he was like a completely different kid. He behaved exactly the way I had shown him at the house.

No, she will learn in time, for some this takes longer.

The unhappiness of the tantrum was her consequence, compounded by its failure to control you or change your mind. You may have to live through a few more, since they are common in tired, hungry, or overstimulated toddlers.

It helped, when I took my daughter or grandson anywhere at that age, to chat with them in advance what we'd be doing, and whether or not there would be a treat at some point. These were always 2-way conversations, in which I'd ask the child how she/he was going to participate, in age-appropriate language/concepts, of course. It worked well.

Empathy is also helpful. If the child knows you care about his/her despair and disappointment, and you can help give him/her the language to talk about feelings, the total collapse of control becomes less necessary.

But occasional melt-downs can still happen. Be strong!

Ugh, I hate the new exit at the Phoenix Zoo that runs straight through the gift shop!!! It's just cruelty to parents.
My older son is almost 6. Our new practice is that he gets a certain amount of money for the trip to the zoo, railroad park, museum, whatever. It is usually $3.00-5.00. We try to bring our lunch and water bottles, so that is covered. Anything that he wants beyond lunch and water, he buys. He has control over whether he wants an ice cream, a sugary drink, or a small toy. When the money is gone, it's gone. Your daughter may be a little young for this right now, but it is a good tactic to look forward to :)

Well... punish, no. Discipline once she calmed down, yes.

If you spent the day or even several hours at the zoo, then your daughter was likely hungry and exhausted mentally and physically. That means that her behavior wasn't entirely in her control. It would still have been appropriate to talk to her about her behavior after she was calmed down so that she'd be receptive to the discussion. She would need praise for the good behavior throughout the day before the gift shop, and you can use that "good day behavior at the zoo" as her example of how you hope she behaves the next time you have to tell her "no" to something she wants.

In the future you can also explain as soon as she's calm enough to reason to her that saying "no" was a positive thing because _________, but if you had said yes then it would have been a bad thing because ________.

The punishment was leaving, no toy.

No. You have to handle things when they happen - which you did, and that's why she threw a tantrum.

For my kids, they know by now that we do not (or VERY rarely) but things from gift shops. They are 6, 8, and 10 now, but we started this when they were babies. So they learned from very young not to expect a toy, shirt, or gadget every time we go somewhere.

So can you start telling her that you are going to the zoo (or wherever), there is a gift shop, but you are not going to buy things. You are going to the zoo to see animals and have a fun family day...not to shop. I did it with my kids well before 3, so it may work for you too.

I wouldn't punish at that point - but I would address it. If she were a little older and writing, she'd be writing a letter to me about what she did wrong and how it made her feel and how she must have made me feel. At that age, she'd be drawing a picture of how the situation made her feel and then another picture of how her tantrum must have made her feel. I'd ask her to include the faces of other people in the store watching the tantrum, too. It's not about punishing - she's three and those are natural impulses. It's about empathy and understanding that her actions have consequences. It won't be great art, but it's a nonverbal way of exploring her feelings and how her behavior affects others. And then I would discuss other behaviors she could have and should have chosen.